Level Review Topic

[Simon]

See attachment. This is not the full set, but only the Genesis-exclusive levels.

The difficulties Present and Sunsoft are complete exclusive sets. In Fun through Mayhem, wide levels have been replaced with exclusives. Some of those are remakes from ONML in the L1 styles.

I don't recall the exact Lemmix physics to set, but Custlemm physics sound adequate. In DOS L1 physics, the level Don't Follow Me is not solvable only solvable with heavy RR fiddling due to the lower splat height in DOS L1.

geoo and me think highly of the level design in the Genesis set. Especially Mayhem 1 and Mayhem 30 are beautiful puzzles here, while they are the lousiest worker grindfests in DOS L1.

-- Simon

[mobius]

thank you very kindly  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/smiley.gif" alt=":)" title="Smiley" class="smiley" />. Those level are awesome. I couldn't beleive how many ports there actually are of lemmings. Wikipedia says there's even a Phillips CD-I port, I bet that's a real horror. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/winktounge.gif" alt=";P" title="Wink-Tongue" class="smiley" />
[now I'll stop digressing the topic]

[finlay]

I don't meant to go off topic but I couldn't see starting a new topic just for a small question. I never heard of the Sega Genesis version of Lemmings until this site. How in the heck do you move a cursor around the screen with the Genesis game controller (or any other controller for that matter?) I'd image the controls must be stiff and slow for Lemmings.

Were these levels released solely on the Sega Genesis? I'd like to get these levels; is there a remade pack for Lemmix or Lemini somewhere?

It's definitely annoying to play Lemmings with a controller. Plus, I've only played Genesis Lemmings via emulation, so I've had to use keyboard controls, which are even worse. The annoyance is abayed somewhat with the analogue controllers on more modern consoles like the Playstation, but not by an awful lot if i'm honest.

[DragonsLover]

I don't recall the exact Lemmix physics to set, but Custlemm physics sound adequate. In DOS L1 physics, the level Don't Follow Me is not solvable due to the lower splat height in DOS L1.

And what's the splat height under Genesis?

Also, which Dos L1: the CD version or the floppy version or whatever? Because there's a difference. If you didn't know already, CD-Dos version of Lemmings has a splat height of 66 pixels while under floppy-Dos, it's the classical 63 pixels.

[ccexplore]

I don't recall the exact Lemmix physics to set, but Custlemm physics sound adequate. In DOS L1 physics, the level Don't Follow Me is not solvable due to the lower splat height in DOS L1.

And what's the splat height under Genesis?

Actually, if I recall, it's not a matter of different splat height per se.  Instead, the difference stems from Genesis not having the "lower" splat height of a miner as you do in DOS L1.  The short summary is that in DOS, (roughly speaking) a miner transitioning to a faller cannot survive as high a fall as a normal walker transitioning to faller.  Whereas I don't think this difference exists in Genesis.  But otherwise I think the splat height is identical in both versions (but it's been a long while since I last checked).

Also, when I ported the Genesis levels over to DOS, I distinctly remember that you can still solve "Don't Follow Me" as-is using the normal DOS splat height--you just have to make some big RR changes that are not possible in Genesis (because Genesis doesn't allow changing RR when paused).

Also, which Dos L1: the CD version or the floppy version or whatever? Because there's a difference. If you didn't know already, CD-Dos version of Lemmings has a splat height of 66 pixels while under floppy-Dos, it's the classical 63 pixels.

Almost all mentions of L1 refers to the normal version.  I practically consider the alleged CD version with different splat-height non-existent, as the last time someone claims to have it and ripped the music, he never made available the game files despite I asking. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/winktounge.gif" alt=";P" title="Wink-Tongue" class="smiley" />

[Nortaneous]

Almost all mentions of L1 refers to the normal version.  I practically consider the alleged CD version with different splat-height non-existent, as the last time someone claims to have it and ripped the music, he never made available the game files despite I asking. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/winktounge.gif" alt=";P" title="Wink-Tongue" class="smiley" />

Oh s*** I completely forgot about that. On it.

edit: Or not. When I try to rip it, it just gives a string of errors. I can install the game from disk, but when I try to run it in Dosbox, it complains about the CD not being there, even if I mount the CD to a drive there first. Great.

[Proxima]

So... is anyone going to review the next level?  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/huh.gif" alt="???" title="Huh?" class="smiley" />

[ccexplore]

edit: Or not. When I try to rip it, it just gives a string of errors. I can install the game from disk, but when I try to run it in Dosbox, it complains about the CD not being there, even if I mount the CD to a drive there first. Great.

D'oh!  Actually, you got far enough that I think at least the main program file (probably vgalemmi.exe or vgal.exe) is probably okay.

Can't you just open the drive up in Window's Explorer (from My Computer etc.) and copy the files that way (select all, drag&drop or copy&paste)?  If you get prompted for any files that are corrupted and unreadable on the CD, you can just skip them over.

I think the CD thing in DOSBox is actually a DOSBox peculiarity--you have to run some special DOSBox commands to "mount" the CD-ROM drive as a CD-ROM drive, it doesn't do it for you automatically.  I'll edit this post if I find the command.  I think the game will run fine in DOSBox after you do that.

This is super-exciting for me because this really does sound like the version of DOS Lemmings that CustLemm was made from.  I have been trying to track down this version forever!

=================

...Um okay, fine, I'll poop out some lines for whatever the next level is. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/winktounge.gif" alt=";P" title="Wink-Tongue" class="smiley" />

[Nortaneous]

Can't you just open the drive up in Window's Explorer (from My Computer etc.) and copy the files that way (select all, drag&drop or copy&paste)?  If you get prompted for any files that are corrupted and unreadable on the CD, you can just skip them over.

http://ifile.it/qh8gzjr" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">Done. What I get when I try to rip the ISO is http://ifile.it/uc5w6rp" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">here, but that's nowhere near large enough to be right. Here's what I get:
nort@skeida:~$ dd if=/dev/cdrom of=~/CDLEMM.iso
dd: reading `/dev/cdrom': Input/output error
2896+0 records in
2896+0 records out
1482752 bytes (1.5 MB) copied, 0.0197881 s, 74.9 MB/s

I think the CD thing in DOSBox is actually a DOSBox peculiarity--you have to run some special DOSBox commands to "mount" the CD-ROM drive as a CD-ROM drive, it doesn't do it for you automatically.  I'll edit this post if I find the command.  I think the game will run fine in DOSBox after you do that.

Isn't it just mount $driveLetter $cdLocation -t cdrom?

...Er, no, turns out it's not. That doesn't work, but mount $driveLetter $cdLocation -t cdrom -usecd 0 works, although it makes Lemmings basically unplayable in Dosbox, at least on Linux.

[ccexplore]

Genesis - Sunsoft 4 - Train Your Body

http://www.neolemmix.com/levelimg/extra/0304.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

10 lemmings
Save 100%
RR 1
5 minutes

12 builders, 5 bashers, 3 diggers

Good: a decent "study the terrain to find a good path" type of level.  Skillset tolerates execution errors without being too generous.  Only 10 lemmings helps avoid the problem of making someone from the crowd bash the right direction.

Bad: Hidden trap a little cheap, and pretty much unnecessary I think.  Seems to require a bit of building no matter how you approach it.  The left column of steel plates not quite lining up with bottom of the terrain block looks a little odd.

Okay, toilet flushed (definitely not a level I'd have reviewed by choice), moving on...... http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/winktounge.gif" alt=";P" title="Wink-Tongue" class="smiley" />

[ccexplore]

Isn't it just mount $driveLetter $cdLocation -t cdrom?

...Er, no, turns out it's not. That doesn't work, but mount $driveLetter $cdLocation -t cdrom -usecd 0 works, although it makes Lemmings basically unplayable in Dosbox, at least on Linux.

Hmm, mount d <cdlocation> -t cdrom seems to work fine for me, but I'm not using Linux, and I didn't actually have the CD with me or try to play it off the CD itself (I think the game files are supposed to go on hard disk and not directly run off of the CD).

Anyway, thanks for the game files and the music.  I confirm that this is indeed the game with the higher fall distance, and thus is the most likely source of how CustLemm came about (indeed, the game EXE's file size is identical to CustLemm's).  Both Lemmings and ONML uses this higher fall distance in this version.

Digging around the EXE, it has "v1.91" somewhere in there.  Not sure what version numbers (if any) can be found in the original versions of the PC games.

[Proxima]

Genesis - Sunsoft 5 - Watch your step
http://www.neolemmix.com/levelimg/extra/0305.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

50 lemmings
Save 98% (49)
RR 50
6 minutes

1 bomber, 1 blocker, 10 builders, 1 basher

Good: Another neat "separate the worker lemming" puzzle in a similar style to Anxiety.
Bad: Much simpler than Anxiety, as there's not really much you can try. Taxing 2 was much earlier in the game; did they really think by now we would still find "use the far left of the level area" an interesting novelty?

[mobius]

Genesis, Sunsoft level 6: "Libra"

http://www.neolemmix.com/levelimg/extra/0208.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

(lucky for me I got an easy level  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/winktounge.gif" alt=";P" title="Wink-Tongue" class="smiley" />) on that note; the present and sunsoft categories apparently are not harder than mayhem per say (like I expected) but have levels of all difficulties.

Lemmings: 60
save: 48 (80%)
time: 5 min
RR: 50
skills: 15 blockers and 15 bombers

good: It's not what I would've expected for a bomboozle level and it looks mildly interesting.
bad: It's a little too easy especially for "sunsoft" (of course as I mentioned above I'm guessing these extra categories were like bonus levels or something?) I beat it with 5 of each skill remaining and could've done better. I also don't understand the title, is it the shape of the level? It kinda looks like a scale.... I guess.
I like the layout but would've come up with a better skill-set/strategy

I noticed the genesis creators apparently really like the spinning trap in marble terrain. They have a bunch of them in place of acid in some instances.

note: I used an image from google because the link in this topic doesn't work quite right. When I click on the picture (on that other site) it goes to the top of the page.  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/huh.gif" alt="???" title="Huh?" class="smiley" />

[Proxima]

Genesis - Sunsoft 7 - Everyone turn left (part two)
http://www.neolemmix.com/levelimg/extra/0307.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

10 lemmings
Save 100%
RR 30
3 minutes

40 miners

Good: Makes for a cute "fewest skills" challenge
Bad: Tedious (if done the normal way) and not especially interesting

[mobius]

wow, I just had a zen moment. This level stumped me earlier, then just now, I sat down, "meditated" and said; I will solve this level. Then in less than two minutes I did!
Also I thought I'd mention the ^previous level is not solvable in Lemmini because you can't mine at all the wrong way on one way blocks http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" class="smiley" />


Genesis - Sunsoft 8 - Is This a Circus?

http://www.neolemmix.com/levelimg/extra/0308.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

Lemmings: 10
Rescue: 10
Time: 3 minutes
RR: 1

Build: 8
Bash: 2
everything else: 0


Good: I liked the 'Circus' design. I also really like the trick in the beginning to isolate the lemmings.

Bad: another genesis level with that pattern I'm noticing; some builders and a small amount of terrain removal skills. I don't really know why but it's getting on my nerves (just a tiny bit).