Level Design Contest #26 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)

[Armani]

Resolved all the updated levels. (all R1s, all R2s and kaywhyn's R3)

[Armani]

@kaywhyn
That's exactly the intended solution! Well done!

I got to ask, why 55 stoners?  Perhaps that's the "irony"?

Spoiler

Perhaps I didn't want to give away the fact that you need to use all the 3 stoners.
If you're given exactly 3 stoners, that usually feels like you are gonna use all of them. (or is it just me? )
But here you are given far more stoners than you can afford to lose so you know you can use <4 stoners but you are not sure
how many of them will be used in the solution.
No idea on why I chose the random number 55!
The RR is also 55 though

[NieSch]

@kaywhyn @Armani: Well done solving my R1 level (again)! Your solutions are fine or even a bit better than my intended one, see attachment.

[IchoTolot]

@kaywhyn @Armani: You both got the same acceptable/intended solution to my R1, great job!

The saved blocker is exactly for avoiding that one timing thing as kaywhyn described!

@Armani:

Still a bad backroute to R2 though. More steel should fix it hopefully.

[kaywhyn]

@Armani

R1: Your replay doesn't work for the latest version of it, which is V3. I guess that's my fault, since I forgot to mention that I updated my R1 to fix your backroute in V2 Also if you redownloaded the collection pack my V3 is in there, and you would had seen that your replay for V2 doesn't work So, I still have no idea if my R1 is properly patched up yet, although I think I thought up of something that might be taken advantage of in it, but well, let's see first

R2: Yup, still a backroute. For V9, I moved the basher pickup, so this might be back to the drawing board

R3: Backroute as well. For V5, I increased the RR to 70, as well as locked the RR, and I smoothed out the terrain near the frog traps.


Once more, nobody still has gotten the intended solutions to any of my levels It's my R1 that I really want to know if it is properly patched or still very broken. R2 and R3 I think are more or less completely patched now, but well, let's see. Keep those replays coming!

[Crane]

@Amrani:

For Perilous Parkour, the speedy solution is a backroute, and the conservative solution is almost intended, although an oversight permitted a small shortcut.  Easy enough to fix though.  V5 uploaded

[ericderkovits]

Here are my replays for :

Cranes Rule 2 level both Talismans

and

Kaywhyn's Rule 1 level (most likely not intended since I had skills left over)

[Crane]

Dang, every nook and cranny is being used against me!  Nice one eric.  V6 incoming.

[kaywhyn]

@eric Yes, that is a backroute for my R1. For V4, I lowered the upper right fire trap, as well as added more fire traps and a small steel block. I think this still won't be enough, but I think I know of a few other ways in which the level can still be backrouted. However, let's see how V4 stands up to scrutiny.

Also, I asked you kindly long ago to not bug me about me not going for talismans, but you're apparently still pestering me about that, not on this site but offsite. It's a personal decision of mine, and if you don't like that I don't go for them, deal with it. I honestly don't care about them at all, as I have repeatedly said several times. What I take issue with is you saying you don't care for them but you go for them anyway. I'm not bothered by you going for those solutions, that's not the problem, but rather the contradiction in what you say and do. Not only that, but you saying that I'm the only one who doesn't go for them. That's not cool at all to single me out like that, when that's obviously not true, since there's some others who don't as well.

This isn't my biggest gripe, though. I'm even more bothered by how you took levels/conversions of mine from last year and changed them without my permission or without discussing the changes with me first. Always, always ask the author first. There'll be less problems this way. Especially in a case like this, as I tend to be very overprotective of my content.

I honestly don't want to have a falling out with you too, but you haven't acknowledged or owed up to me with these things, so that's quite hurtful for me.


Anyway, for everyone else, no intended solutions for any of my levels yet I honestly didn't expect them to be backrouted so much. Especially my R3, which I consider to be very meh and not all that interesting IMO.   

[NieSch]

@kaywhyn

I'll give the level [R2] a rest now and come back to it later.

I haven't solved it but I'm getting closer to what is intended I suspect. See the attachment for my best attempt.

Spoiler

I need to get another lemming up left to bomb free the path for the climber but I don't know how.

[Armani]

resolved
I might have found the intended solutions to The Living Ininite and Outdoor Lemmings Rangers to the Rescue.

[IchoTolot]

@Armani

Yes, finally that is intended! Great job!

[kaywhyn]

@Armani

R1 - Yup, still pretty broken. For V5, added some steel, replaced some water with fire traps, and shifted some of the area on the far left down some. I don't think this will catch everything yet, and if it doesn't, I'm thinking of putting in a timer for the next version. However, it depends on how bad the backroute is, so let's see first.

R2 - Both solutions are backroutes, and it seems the way the laser was used was the source of the backroutes in both replays. So, for V10 I added another steel block.

R3 - Finally, a level of mine solved 100% intended! I was even generous here giving more swimmers than needed


Also, finally resolved all R2 and R3, as well as got Armani's R3 solved. My entire replay collection is attached, including my solutions to Ichos' levels. I will attach the intended solutions to my levels at a later time, once all of them have been solved the intended way or are deemed acceptable.

These all seem to be intended/acceptable solutions except for Crane's R2, as I was still able to backroute it

Spoiler

I'm very positive the way I used the miner is not intended! Thus, I was able to spare the shimmier again Also, I "stunlocked" the lemming in place by infinitely assigning the jumper at the bottom

@Armani

My solution to your R3 seems quite hackish, especially with the way one of the shimmiers is used, although maybe it's intended? I'm not sure.

Spoiler

This one was harder than I thought it be. I kept thinking to use a builder from right to left to catch the climber coming from above, but instead I came up with a hackish way to avoid that by bombing twice. This was hard to find, as the bombers need to be very precise. I also used one of the shimmiers as a delay/stall tactic. Otherwise, this is a great puzzle, thinking about how to spare a shimmier to get the worker lemming to build and seal the gap to the exit and then mine everyone free from the other side. Time is much tighter than I thought it be too, and so I used the blocker to reduce the amount of walking back and forth the climber does to save those precious seconds.

@Icho

I needed to resolve your R2, as apparently the change right where the exit is was enough to break it. However, the jumper assignments in that area were the only ones I needed to tweak, and so ultimately this solution is more or less the same as my pre-testing one, sparing a shimmier as well. However, it seems that it hasn't opened up any major backroute, so it's probably still in the acceptable region?

My replay for your R3 is the same one from pre-testing, so no need to check that one. For your R1, that replay is the one from a few days ago, and you have said that it is now acceptable/intended, so don't need to check that one either.


@Niesch

R2 doesn't really need any checking, as even though it broke my replay and hence I had to resolve it, the change is simply to block getting a climber to certain buttons.

Your R3 seems solid and intended now! Funny thing was that I couldn't figure it out last night, but when I came back to it tonight I had no problems with it You also seem to very much love 1-of-everything levels, as recently I was helping Ryemanni out with one of your Tricky levels from LLL because he had been stuck on it for a few days. I love these types of levels too, although the ones I've seen from you are quite challenging! Not a bad thing at all, I love hard levels and a good challenge

Spoiler

The digger was quite hard to see here. I kept thinking to use it on the pillar the climber goes over, but then that creates the problem where the miner use won't be able to release the crowd later. 

All rightie, I'll be back to resolve any patched up levels that need it at a much later time. I definitely need a break from these contest entries, especially since fixing mine up prove to be just as much work as playing and solving these! Nice job to everyone with their levels!    

[NieSch]

@Niesch
Your R3 seems solid and intended now! Funny thing was that I couldn't figure it out last night, but when I came back to it tonight I had no problems with it You also seem to very much love 1-of-everything levels, as recently I was helping Ryemanni out with one of your Tricky levels from LLL because he had been stuck on it for a few days. I love these types of levels too, although the ones I've seen from you are quite challenging! Not a bad thing at all, I love hard levels and a good challenge

It's intended, well done. Yes, I really like 1-of-everything levels. There's seven of them in my pack LLL. Most of the time the solution turns out to be harder to find than I thought, like in this R3-case.

[Armani]

@kaywhyn
r1 and r2 are intended as I already mentioned r3 is a backroute.
And I resolved the updated 2 levels.