[SUG][PLAYER] Toggle panel view to show how many skills you've used so far

[Silken Healer]

I see now. Why don't you want to implement it so if you hold shift and the mouse cursor is over a skill tile it shows the skills remaining for the individual skill aswell as a hotkey which changes all of them

[WillLem]

Before things get too out of hand, my suggestion is this and only this:

A hotkey that toggles the entire panel to show skills used, as shown in Reply #2.

So, NOT individual skills, NOT showing both used/remaining simultaneously, and NOT a clickable button on the panel for toggling the view; these are things that have come up in the conversation, but I'm not necessarily in support of any of these ideas.

Regarding these; as Proxima said, showing both figures is confusing, would clutter up the panel, and there isn't enough space to do it anyway. Toggling individual skills, whilst useful, is not entirely necessary so I'm probably 50/50 on that one (namida appears to have ruled it out at this point anyway).

Having a clickable button, meanwhile, might simply be a case of expanding the panel to have an extra slot; I've created this topic to consolidate this idea into something inclusive of current features.

Again, though, the primary idea as shown here (and the one namida appears to have agreed upon) is the only one I'm promoting in this topic.

[namida]

I see now. Why don't you want to implement it so if you hold shift and the mouse cursor is over a skill tile it shows the skills remaining for the individual skill aswell as a hotkey which changes all of them

Because it's unneccessary. I can't imagine any situation where it would be important to be able to display "skills used" for one skill, but "skills remaining" for all other skills, at the same time. The inverse could certianly be a bit more useful (generally showing skills used, but able to quickly check the skills remaining for one skill), but I still don't feel this is a strong enough need to justify implementing this.

However, one point that is raised by this latter example - is that there could certianly be situations where users would want to stay on skills used, rather than just view it temporarily. For this reason, I definitely think that (much like the Clear Physics Mode hotkey) it should be possible to configure this key as either a "hold" or a "toggle". But I'm not at all convinced it needs to exist in a "one skill at a time" form.

[WillLem]

I can't imagine any situation where it would be important to be able to display "skills used" for one skill, but "skills remaining" for all other skills, at the same time.

For Talisman solutions limiting one particular skill, especially where all skills are initially provided in different amounts (and so would be more difficult to track mentally). Could also come in handy for SYCLW, where you may wish to compare usage of two or more constructive/destructive skills.

Granted, these are niche examples and we've been doing well enough so far without such a feature, but I just felt it was worth mentioning that there are situations in which the proposed idea could be of some use.

That said, toggle/hold for the full panel is more than sufficient.

[Silken Healer]

I see now. Why don't you want to implement it so if you hold shift and the mouse cursor is over a skill tile it shows the skills remaining for the individual skill aswell as a hotkey which changes all of them

Because it's unneccessary. I can't imagine any situation where it would be important to be able to display "skills used" for one skill, but "skills remaining" for all other skills, at the same time. The inverse could certianly be a bit more useful (generally showing skills used, but able to quickly check the skills remaining for one skill), but I still don't feel this is a strong enough need to justify implementing this.

However, one point that is raised by this latter example - is that there could certianly be situations where users would want to stay on skills used, rather than just view it temporarily. For this reason, I definitely think that (much like the Clear Physics Mode hotkey) it should be possible to configure this key as either a "hold" or a "toggle". But I'm not at all convinced it needs to exist in a "one skill at a time" form.

I don't really see the harm in adding a feature where if you hover your mouse over the skill tile and press SHIFT it has a few uses aswell

[namida]

You "don't see the harm" because you are not the one who has to implement, maintain, and bugfix such a feature - as well as the wider code that it adds complexity to.

I am the one who has to do that, and I am not remotely convinced that the effort that would need to go into implementing such a feature is justified by the very, very, VERY limited benefit it adds over just having a general "all skills at once" version of this idea. Even the original idea is fairly niche, but it does have use cases that significantly benefit from it even if they're quite niche, and it's much simpler to implement than a per-skill version. By comparison, the per-skill idea offers nearly no extra advantage over being able to do it for all skills at once, let alone enough advantage to justify the work involved.

I'm ending this discussion now: A per-skills version of this idea will not be happening, period.

[Silken Healer]

Oh yeah. Sorry, I forgot about how the code could be really complex and bug fixing it

[WillLem]

Oh yeah. Sorry, I forgot about how the code could be really complex and bug fixing it

Don't sweat it. Until you give coding a try yourself, it's easy to forget (or not even realise) how difficult and/or time-consuming it can be even to do something simple like adding a button or displaying an image, let alone implementing something complex and multilayered.

[Silken Healer]

Thanks WillLem. Anyway, now namida has offically rejected the idea of toggiling individual skill tiles due to the coding complexicty compared to practical uses, what does everyone think the toggle hotkey should be?

[Dullstar]

Honestly, sometimes with code complexity you can have a feature that's simple to implement if you planned it from the start, but depending on how the code evolved, can be a royal pain to add in later.

I don't have an objection to this idea, but likely wouldn't be making much use of it either. That said, I agree it's likely too niche to justify a skill panel button for.

[namida]

what does everyone think the toggle hotkey should be?

There will be no default hotkey assigned (you must assign one yourself)

^ In addition to this, I'd also note that in general, hotkeys can be configured so there doesn't particularly need to be a huge consensus on what the key should be for any given function.

[namida]

Commit 14b1e3e has implemented the actual functionality on this. Commit 5c1033b then improves the visuals - colors are inverted when displaying used skill count (ie: black number on white background), and zero will be displayed as a zero rather than a blank panel.

As mentioned, both toggle and hold are supported (similar to how for Clear Physics Mode you can either configure a press-and-hold hotkey or just a press-to-toggle one). Also as mentioned, an implementation to show this for one skill at a time (or all except one skill) is not going to happen. Any other further input, go ahead - leaving the topic open for now in case there is any.

EDIT: Actually, one question is what to do on the offchance that, in a level with infinite uses of a certain skill provided, the player uses more than 99. I'm not going to implement code to try and squeeze 3 digits like the SR does; but I'm open to three possibilities (with the first being how it's currently coded):
a) The used count maxes out at 99, and any higher number is just displayed as 99 (note that higher numbers are still tracked internally for talisman / record purposes; this is purely a maximum on what the panel will display)
b) The used count displays a purpose-made "100+" graphic that just holds the general meaning of "100 or more"
c) The last two digits of the used count are displayed

[WillLem]

Commit 14b1e3e has implemented the actual functionality on this.

Brillo! Is this in 12.11.3?

Commit 5c1033b then improves the visuals - colors are inverted when displaying used skill count (ie: black number on white background), and zero will be displayed as a zero rather than a blank panel.

How about green on black as per reply #2? Not important, of course, but worth asking.

As for 99+ skill usage, I'd suggest either:

a) The used count maxes out at 99, and any higher number is just displayed as 99

or, display the "infinity" symbol. If 99, maybe it should change colour?

[namida]

Brillo! Is this in 12.11.3?

No, it won't be in any 12.11.X release, but it's a confirmed feature for 12.12.X. For the record - 12.11.3 only backported a few bugfixes, not any new features (and even one bugfix, I opted not to backport just because I felt it would be safer for that particular fix to go through the RC phase first).

How about green on black as per reply #2? Not important, of course, but worth asking.

The one thing to consider here is custom panels. While most do stick to white-on-black, they're not forced to do so. Inverting should produce a result that works well regardless of what the original colors are (just as long as they aren't set up in some weird unusual way).

[WillLem]

The one thing to consider here is custom panels. While most do stick to white-on-black, they're not forced to do so. Inverting should produce a result that works well regardless of what the original colors are

Good shout