Wibble's thoughts on Lix Lemforum levels

[Wibble]

On the Quirky set

Overall an enjoyable set of levels that don't just rely on using 2 blockers and a trailblazer like so many of the originals. All have a different feel to them.

Levels that are easier than their placing -

Spoiler

Prelude to me is on a par with the very beginning levels of this difficulty, and I think easier than some of the Lovely levels. AS my replay shows, its about at Tricky difficulty for the original Lemmings

Spoiler

The Razor's Edge goes under the category of "very easy if you know how, otherwise very tough", making it hard to rank. I was aware the bridges planks go through very thin walls so got this first time.

Levels that are harder than their placing -

Spoiler

None stuck out as horrendous - Exit Stage Right and Path to Mahiman took the longest but looking back don't seem that tough. I think I got a bit lucky with Tower of Babel as well

Other notes

All Around the World - the method I have attached in the replay has pretty exact placement of skills.

Spoiler

I'm guessing the intention is to jump over the sanctuary and mine down the other side, thinking about it?

Another Lix in the Wall - I noticed in another thread there was mention of losing a platform for this one as it was quite a fiddly method somewhere. My attached solution uses a platform but isn't fiddly at all. Is mine the intended method?

In terms of favourite levels for aesthetics, I seem to go for the 2 extremes - Insane Steve seems to favour very minimalist looking levels that appear much more horrible than they really are to complete, whilst Michael S Repton's levels feel more true to the art style of the original games and add a touch of nostalgia. 

Favourites to play in particular were Tribute to Flagpole Sitting, Box Set, The Rainbow Road, The Final Sacrifice, and Every Which Way But Loose.

[Minim]

In terms of favourite levels for aesthetics, I seem to go for the 2 extremes - Insane Steve seems to favour very minimalist looking levels that appear much more horrible than they really are to complete, whilst Michael S Repton's levels feel more true to the art style of the original games and add a touch of nostalgia.

It's interesting that you pointed out that one author created minimalist looking levels. Insane Steve's not the only designer that had a penchant for these; one of the DMA designers did a similar thing. I'll mention this in more detail in a new thread.

[geoo]

Thanks for your comments! Also interesting to read your list of favourites - some of them are favourites of mine as well while some are very much not. Makes me happy there's such a variety of levels in the pack, for everyone some levels that speak to them.
Good luck on Cunning!
Some comments on individual levels below:

Prelude - There are definitely other solutions to this level as well. I believe this is one meant to be open-ended, but wait for Proxima to confirm whether your solution is a backroute.

Another Lix in the Wall - I don't know if Nortaneous had a specific solution in mind. There is definitely a variety of solutions, and some of them are not fiddly at all. I guess it's all a matter of how hard you try to push your initial idea through.

All Around the World

Spoiler

That should be the intended solution, and I don't think there are alternative solutions? This trick necessarily needs some precise skill placement, but at least the square/rectangular blocks help you find the correct placement very easily. Generally the aim is to avoid precise placement/timing whenever possible, but especially in the later levels you will have some necessarily precise assignments here and there.

Tower of Babel - Interesting solution! This one is quite open-ended too, and there are definitely less 'risky' solutions out there as well.

[Wibble]

In terms of favourite levels for aesthetics, I seem to go for the 2 extremes - Insane Steve seems to favour very minimalist looking levels that appear much more horrible than they really are to complete, whilst Michael S Repton's levels feel more true to the art style of the original games and add a touch of nostalgia.

It's interesting that you pointed out that one author created minimalist looking levels. Insane Steve's not the only designer that had a penchant for these; one of the DMA designers did a similar thing. I'll mention this in more detail in a new thread.

It's not just the minimalist look so much as the minimalist and impossible look together that does it for me. Levels like the Little Miner Puzzles are minimalist too for example but appear more accessible at first (even if they do then have twists that show how well designed they are).

[Wibble]

On the Cunning set

Levels that seem easier than Cunning

Once You Pop You Can't Stop 

Spoiler

Reminds me of the Tricky level in the original that is a reskin of Fun 5? Except you don't even need to get the timing right.

Cry for me 

Spoiler

Basically a remake of Land of Unicorns and Rainbows with an extra trapdoor added and lots of extra skills

Skulls Sludge and Steel

Spoiler

Back to trailblazer mode. Looks good though.

Erbalunga -

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like the idea behind it but it is a much easier variant of It Takes Time to Build

Tick Toxic -

Spoiler

Couple of skills to spare, completed first time (which is rare for me)

Levels that seem harder than Cunning

Again, none stick out as needing to move to Daunting as such. I found The Ob3lisk (missed opportunity on the title, surely The Obelix?) very fiddly with needing to issue so many floaters. Some Like to Run took me a long time to figure out, and Snowball Battle was tough too, but both are I think in the right band. Mental Process requires a bit of a trick in there that it took me a while to see, same with Lix Cannon.

Favourite levels:

Jacob's Ladder - looks great

Spoiler

Took me a bit of time to find a solution and it was a bit of a guess as to whether it would work, but I'm guessing it was the intended method as I really can't see any other way

Seven Pillars of Lixdom - classic looking level and a great puzzle.

Labyrinth of Persia - looks great and taught me that

Spoiler

torches burn

It takes time to build

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Stalling galore!

I also enjoyed Under the Rainbow and Mental Process.

[Wibble]

A few other level attachments - Lix Cannon and LMP3 both felt a bit fiddly with how I did them, and I am curious as to whether my solution for Under the Rainbow is the only one

Spoiler

I don't think you can bridge the big gap and have enough skills to survive it all?

[geoo]

Cry for me -- I'm not sure I see the resemblance.

Skulls Sludge and Steel

Spoiler

At some point, all states of lix (e.g. splatter, burner, tumbler, ...) were assignable skills, and this level originally was designed to showcase that the
burner can be a useful skill. I tried to adapt the level to work with imploders instead, but evidently I failed. I think the two stalactites that are close to each other should maybe be replaced with a buzzsaw, see attached. That said, it doesn't really make that much of a difference to the level in the end.

Erbalunga -

Spoiler

I never realized. I've never seen Erbalunga as a stalling level, maybe because somehow there's more to figure out here (i.e., which group does the building) than in the other level. It takes time to build was added much later, and so I didn't have the association that it's quite similar to a level in its vicinity.

Tick Toxic -

Spoiler

This one is quite open-ended and various ideas work.

I found The Ob3lisk (missed opportunity on the title, surely The Obelix?) very fiddly with needing to issue so many floaters.

It kinda goes together with the level The Mon0lith, which will come much later. They were both part of Insane Steve's Cheapo pack, though the Ob3lisk there was a humongous vertical level. I'm actually not sure if my down scaling is really in the spirit of the original level, I wanted something intimidating looking, but I think it wasn't possible to replicate the solution for the original level, so I went for something else. It's not one of my better levels and turned out more annoying to execute than I hoped, but I guess it's alright in the spirit of variety... Why do you think The Obelix is a better title here? Maybe I'm missing something.

Some Like to Run took me a long time to figure out.

I believe this is actually a backroute. Let me tighten the spawn interval (attached) to hopefully fix it. We should probably cross-check with Minim though as I'm not sure I know all nuances of the intended solution.

LMP3 is intended, there's a bit of timing to work out at the end that's hard to predict and thus might need a few tries to get right.

I'm not aware of any other solutions to Under the Rainbow.

[Wibble]

On Obelix - I just meant the fact it has the word "lix" in and sounds like obelisk. Nothing more than that really! That said I didn't know it linked to another level, and now you mention that I understand the reason behind the title!

On the comparison made for Cry For Me (both attached)

Spoiler

Ignoring the extra trapdoor for Cry for Me for a moment, both levels have you send a climber up to get a bridge/platform to the sanctuary, and then bash through to link the 2 lower trapdoors and bridge to cover the bashed hole. The main differences are that Land then has you mine through the block whilst Cry lets you just assign climbers to all Lix. Cry then adds the 3rd trapdoor which just requires a bridge to the top tier then bashing through to win (and you have floaters for any lix that slip through before the bridge is built.) Just my opinion but I think the difficulty level for these 2 is really similar

Should add as well that any comments I make are intended as observation rather than criticism, I like all of the levels so far in their own way.

[Wibble]

On the Daunting set:

I haven't completed them all yet, there are 7 left to do, all of which I have looked at but can't do yet - namely Tribute to Benny Hill, Derailed Level, I'm Gonna Make you Mine, Passing Engagement, To Destroy is to Construct, Two For His Heels, and The Lix Who Japed. So I suppose they are the ones I think are the hardest!

Will post 6 levels at a time with comments and my solutions.

Rhapsody - Nice and relatively easy opener, just needed a few tries to see which skills were employed in which places.

Round Trip - Completed 1st attempt, the easiest level in this set?

Death or Glory - Took a few goes to see what was going on here, I like the design on this one.

Over My Head - For me, it was for a while! This one is up there with my favourites for daunting. 

Spoiler

I like the slightly unintuitive idea that the runner isn't actually sprinting ahead, its a regular walker who is used for the foot race to get the bridge placed

Backslash - Minimalist level showing a useful trick, I like it.

Spoiler

Should have saw the hint in the name a bit quicker

Now This is Fun - Bit of a slog this one, I feel it could have been compacted a bit whilst maintaining the same puzzles? My replay looks very un-optimised, I'm sure I could have used fewer skills to solve it in a similar way.

[Forestidia86]

Round Trip - Completed 1st attempt, the easiest level in this set?

I agree that this level is easy compared to the others in this rank because the solution is indicated by the layout of the terrain.

Congrats on beating many hard levels fast. It's interesting that "Passing Engagement" and "The Lix Who Japed" seem to give you trouble since for me they were on the more doable side whereas other levels that you seem to have solved gave me much more trouble.

[geoo]

Nice to see that the levels you're stuck on are mostly in the later part of Daunting. At least the ordering isn't completely off.
(The very last level is special in a way and expected to be a bit easier I'd say.)

Round Trip: This is one of Insane Steve's Cheapo levels, I remember it giving me a good amount of trouble back then (not sure why), which probably explains its original position in the pack. It already got down-ranked quite a bit, if I recall. Funnily enough, "A Towering Proposition" from Cunning (EDIT: Just realized it's actually in early Daunting) is also one of Steve's levels and in the Cheapo pack it's in the last rank, while here it didn't even make it into the second half of the community pack. The baseline difficulty for levels has significantly increased over time...

Over My Head - it's a minor variation (slightly different digger position) on the solution I know, but very much in the same spirit. I agree, the level looks simple but is not so obvious after all.

Backslash - if I recall you can save one extra (if you want)

Now This is Fun - I agree, I'd say it's a bit in the spirit of Save Me from the original game. Daunting and quite a bit of work to pull off. Not so much my flavor of level either, but it adds some variety I think.

[Wibble]

I have completed Derailed Level, The Lix Who Japed, and To Destroy is to Construct now, so just 4 left.

Variety Day - Took a while to figure out

Spoiler

Mainly trying to ensure that the climber was not the lix used as the blocker

A Towering Proposition - Completed 1st attempt, definitely among the easiest of the levels for this set.

Feel the Pressure - A combination of ideas from earlier levels. Replay has a random basher and a long wait at 1 point for reasons I do not recall!

Merge Sort - Really like the idea behind this one, very clever! Classic case of a level where trying things out for a bit lets you see the trick.

A Soulful Bounding Leap! - Nice to see a level using jumpers in a less obvious way. The idea on how to complete was found quickly but tweaking skills around to actually execute it took longer.

Go West - Very easy when you know how - it took a while for me to know how however!

Spoiler

For a while I got caught up trying to mine to the bottom and use the terrain to bridge back up

[Wibble]

Alternative Route Required - Trailblazer fare with a limited skillset to choose from.

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And all of the skills used, at least for my go

This Lix is Your Lix -

Spoiler

a race of sorts. Getting the timing of the jump to turn round at the end of the platform and not hit the blade was a little fiddly

Tribute to Benny Hill - My attempt is below, it saves only 4 lix though is a couple of skill short of saving all of them. I think I have some elements of the solution correct but am missing something. Feels significantly tougher than all the levels around it, though it could be a very easy one where I am missing something simple. Hints would be appreciated at this point  

Spoiler

The title implies that having the climber chase/be chased by the rest, most likely in fast forward, to synch with them is the right idea. I just can't see how to synch all of them. Or indeed where the parachutes come in - they don't open from any tradpoor or from any bridge smaller than 2 bridges.

Railroad Plot - Seemed relatively easy for the difficulty, this only took a couple of goes.

Derailed Level - On the other hand this one took a lot of attempts.

Spoiler

For a while I was using the cube to block the other lix instead of just digging. I also didn't consider having any lix other than a climber building the platform, trying to go from right to left using the curved motion lines of the train. I feel a little cheated that the derailed train is not at all part of the solution, at least, not part of mine.

Lixes in Motion - Nice timing puzzle.

Spoiler

Took a while to think of using a different lix to the digger to build the bridge, thus saving skills and time

[Forestidia86]

Tribute to Benny Hill - My attempt is below, it saves only 4 lix though is a couple of skill short of saving all of them. I think I have some elements of the solution correct but am missing something. Feels significantly tougher than all the levels around it, though it could be a very easy one where I am missing something simple. Hints would be appreciated at this point  

Spoiler

The title implies that having the climber chase/be chased by the rest, most likely in fast forward, to synch with them is the right idea. I just can't see how to synch all of them. Or indeed where the parachutes come in - they don't open from any tradpoor or from any bridge smaller than 2 bridges.

Following seven hints that should get more spoilery the higher their number is but your mileage may vary. Hope they help, good success on solving the level.

Hint 1

Think about how the parachutes can help you with what you are trying to attempt.

Hint 2

Consider how many builders you have available.

Hint 3

Think about how the parachutes affect the movement of the Lix.

Hint 4

The falling movement of the parachute lix is slower than of the non-parachute ones.

Hint 5

With the amount of builders available you can gain enough height to make use of the parachutes.

Hint 6

You are right that clustering with the use of fast forward is the key.

Hint 7

It is possible to solve the level without the climber.

[Wibble]

Thanks, I got it off the first hint and read the rest after. Sometimes you just need a bit of a nudge - knowing that a skill I had ruled out was necessary was enough. The thing I was missing was

Spoiler

there is a ramp to increase the height from 2 bridges to increase the height to a parachutable one

Lets just say I'm glad that this game has a fast forward!

This Is Too Much Stepping Stones - I like the puzzle element of this level but it is fiddly

Spoiler

I only just had enough bridges, and felt a little lucky needing only 2 bridges at the top of the level

Jack In the Box - Spotted this one relatively quickly, a nice minimalist level.

Spoiler

One of my failed attempts on Backslash helped as I inadvertently made a "cube" from a builder there

Slipping - Took a while to see the trick for this one, again it came from solving a different level

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segmentation fault

Slipping Again - This one was easier than Slipping 

Spoiler

But if the order were reversed this would be harder - once you have the trick for Slipping a lot of the puzzle is done for you

Lix Ferenda - When I saw Lix Lata I thought that was a level that looked a lot harder than it was, I see now that this remake is the reason! I feel from the replay I was not fully optimal and more can be saved.

Spoiler

On other failed attempts I platformed from the top to trap all the lix in the beams to the right of the trapdoors, but chose to go lower so that I could get a few to the lower levels without parachutes as I was exploding and blocking with the 3 given so couldn't see how to complete the level with a high platform 

Segmentation Fault - Sad as it was to see all those lix splat, I liked this level a lot. Took a bit of time for me to see the trick

Spoiler

building a platform on a digger space to reduce fall distance , which helped with other levels