[SUG][PLAYER] "Timer bypass" for nuke

Started by namida, June 27, 2020, 10:32:22 PM

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namida

So, a recent discussion occurred around potentially removing the timer from the nuke. The eventual decision was that it leads to unnecessary breakage.

However, as the flipside to this - if the timer isn't being removed, it makes sense to specifically add features to minimize the frustration that arises from it.

Therefore, here's the proposal: A new feature - which would not become the main method of activating the nuke - which essentially becomes a shortcut for "go back 5 seconds, start the nuke, then go forward the 5 seconds again". Of course, the "5 seconds" would be frame-perfect to the nuke's duration.

This would not truly bypass the timer as such. Physics don't change at all - it's purely a UI feature to reduce the need to time the activation of it.

Perhaps this could even be expanded to "Select a lemming; then - if such a nuke timing is possible - insert a Nuke action earlier in the replay, such that the selected lemming will complete his countdown on the current frame".
My projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)
Non-Lemmings: Commander Keen: Galaxy Reimagined (a Commander Keen fangame)

namida

And just to clear this up now: No, there is ZERO chance of "regular bombers return to timed, either as an option or the standard behaviour, with a similar feature existing as an optional way of using them". There are many reasons for this, and in particular the fact that the nuke's current behaviour would not be retained were it not for the need to preserve existing NeoLemmix content that would be affected significantly by the change.
My projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)
Non-Lemmings: Commander Keen: Galaxy Reimagined (a Commander Keen fangame)

Crane

I'm sort of neutral on this one.  I suppose the frustration comes from levels where nuke timers have to be frame-precise.  In this case, I'm not sure how different it is from simply pressing the "-" key 5 times first.

Strato Incendus

As long as no content breaks from it (nuke solutions are few and far between anyway), I'm fine with this change. ;)
My packs so far:
Lemmings World Tour (New & Old Formats), my music-themed flagship pack, 320 levels - Let's Played by Colorful Arty
Lemmings Open Air, my newest release and follow-up to World Tour, 120 levels
Paralems (Old Formats), a more flavour-driven one, 150 levels
Pit Lems (Old Formats), a more puzzly one, 100 levels - Let's Played by nin10doadict
Lemmicks, a pack for (very old) NeoLemmix 1.43 full of gimmicks, 170 levels

IchoTolot

I would also be fine with the change.

If it gets implemented: I would then mention the point that lemmings that exit during the 5 second period will still count towards the exploder chain causing a slight delay in the nuke intro-text of the intro pack.

namida

Quote from: Crane on June 28, 2020, 09:04:03 AM
I'm sort of neutral on this one.  I suppose the frustration comes from levels where nuke timers have to be frame-precise.  In this case, I'm not sure how different it is from simply pressing the "-" key 5 times first.

It isn't, outside of the whole "not everyone has a -1 sec skip configured" angle - it would literally just be a shortcut for "go back 5 seconds, nuke, skip forward 5 seconds" (except without having to render the screen after each step).
My projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)
Non-Lemmings: Commander Keen: Galaxy Reimagined (a Commander Keen fangame)

namida

Implemented in commit 52b0f10.

The timer bypass can be activated by right-clicking the nuke button on the panel (as with normal nuking, double-click is needed). It can also be invoked via hotkey; in this case, it is a seperately-assignable hotkey from the normal nuke.

Existing hotkey setups that include a Nuke key will retain their existing key; however the new default will be that traditional layout puts the timer-bypass nuke on F12 instead of the regular nuke. (Functional layout does not have a nuke hotkey and so is unchanged.)
My projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)
Non-Lemmings: Commander Keen: Galaxy Reimagined (a Commander Keen fangame)