PJW's Twenty Lemmings Levels!

PJW · February 10, 2020, 06:28:16 PM

Hi all,

Another newbie, another splurge of levels being shared!

I *think* I've been able to second-guess any backroutes (but then, don't we all think that at the time!), so have attached them to this post as - hopefully! - a reasonably 'finished' product. There are a few levels I'm particularly pleased with. They were created these around a year ago during a period of convalescence, but they're absolutely all do-able. I apologise in advance if any of them turn out to be unenjoyable pigs.

They use existing graphic sets, so hopefully the levels won't be too tricky to load and play.

So, yes, please find attached a zip file containing the 20 .nxlv files and nine mp3 files. (I don't know if it matters, but in my set-up this end, the levels are stored in the levels folder in a folder called 'PJW', whilst the music tracks are individually put in with all the other music tracks as opposed to having their own folder. Thought I'd mention it in case the .nxlv files have trouble locating the mp3 files - I'm so not a technical person!)

Comments etc welcome. Hopefully they'll be a bit of fun and while away an hour or three.

PJW

PJW · February 10, 2020, 06:34:27 PM

Oh, I'm not entirely sure if I've posted this in the right thread! It's not a 'work in progress' as such, as the levels are finished...

Could a kindly mod move this to the main levels-sharing thread if possible...?

Many thanks!

ccexplore · February 10, 2020, 06:37:32 PM

topic moved as requested

Proxima · February 10, 2020, 08:16:07 PM

I'll comment on the levels when I've had time to play through the set. For now, some administrative matters.

Putting the level numbers in the titles/filenames as you have done does ensure they get played in order, but it's better to remove them and instead include a levels.nxmi file (download a pack and look for this file for an example of how one is structured). That means, firstly, that players see the level numbers in the position we're used to seeing them in NeoLemmix; secondly, players who choose not to install your music will get a proper music rotation instead of randomly chosen tracks. (There may be other benefits that I haven't thought of.)

Regarding the music, it's better to put it into a subfolder "PJW" (or whatever you choose to call it) and have the music line in each level refer to the track including folder name, e.g. "PJW/PJW-EB".

IchoTolot · February 16, 2020, 07:49:55 PM

Hey, I've played through your levels today and attached my replays.

Before I give more detailed feeback, I would like to know which ones are backroutes.

PJW · February 17, 2020, 08:49:26 PM

Quote from: IchoTolot on February 16, 2020, 07:49:55 PM
Hey, I've played through your levels today and attached my replays.

Before I give more detailed feeback, I would like to know which ones are backroutes.

Gah!

Every level, you've managed to do in super-efficient ways I hadn't intended! Levels that were designed to send you all over the place, utilising all sorts of aspects, have been conquered annoyingly quickly, haha. Interesting to see, nevertheless, that they weren't as clever as I'd envisaged!

I think I must have misunderstood the term 'backroute' (which I took to mean an alternative, unintended way of completing a level). I thought I'd created levels that could only be done one way, and, oh well, I hadn't... Seems I couldn't see the forests for the trees...!

Thanks for indulging me, anyway. I'll leave the level-making to those far better at it than I! I enjoyed making them nonetheless

Proxima · February 17, 2020, 09:15:05 PM

Quote from: PJW on February 17, 2020, 08:49:26 PMI think I must have misunderstood the term 'backroute' (which I took to mean an alternative, unintended way of completing a level).

It's often misused for that. Really, a "backroute" is an unintended solution that's so simple that it feels more like skipping the puzzle rather than engaging with it -- for instance, the infamous digger pit at the top on "Let's go camping" (if you're familiar with the Genesis levels).

However, some designers are more fastidious than others about enforcing precisely their intended solutions, so they will judge any solution that differs from theirs to be a "backroute" and try to prevent it. There's no clear-cut dividing line.

Incidentally, while I haven't had time to fully play your pack yet, I have had a little look at it, and other than Level 1, they seem to be very hard! I don't think you need to have any doubts about your level-designing ability.

IchoTolot · February 17, 2020, 11:16:44 PM

QuoteThanks for indulging me, anyway. I'll leave the level-making to those far better at it than I!

Don't say that! Backroutes can be fixed and even if I see a few things that can be improved here everybody can make good levels.

Just don't give up.

ccexplore · February 18, 2020, 10:52:26 PM

I think it's no exaggeration to say that if a level started off in its first version without any backroutes, it is almost certainly because the level author has barely any specific solution in mind so that any solution is accepted as okay by the level author. It is rather rare to have a first-version of level be backroute-free, or at least not have some solution that the level author never considered (even if they might accept it either because it is harder in some ways than the intended solution, or it has enough elements in common with intended solution that the author is happy to accept).

You should consider backroute-fixing to simply be an integral and unavoidable part of level creation, and shouldn't shy away from creating levels just because backroutes exist. Just look at the level contest threads and see how many times almost all the levels get updated for backroute fixing! Have faith that even the most backroute-ridden levels can usually be salvaged once enough backroute fixes are in place, and sometimes in the process you may end up with a better level than even you originally planned.

Dullstar · February 19, 2020, 04:53:04 AM

In addition: if you're having trouble fixing the backroutes, you can post the intended solutions and someone will probably help you fix the level if you ask. I've done that before when I felt like I was running out of ideas on changes I could make to the level. Of course, you should definitely try to fix them yourself first.

WillLem · February 19, 2020, 11:24:26 AM

Quote from: Proxima on February 17, 2020, 09:15:05 PM
Incidentally, while I haven't had time to fully play your pack yet, I have had a little look at it, and other than Level 1, they seem to be very hard! I don't think you need to have any doubts about your level-designing ability.

I concur: these are some very challenging levels. So far level 1 is the only one I've managed to complete.

(Not that my level-solving abilities are anywhere near the standard of some forum members, but still - you have an eye for a puzzle!)

I've found it fascinating watching other people's replays of my levels and thinking "how did I not spot that!" when someone clearly bypasses a massive chunk of the level. It's all part of the process of learning to create levels, and helps you to start seeing it through a player's eyes a bit more during the design process.

Also, IchoTolot is known on the forum as being particularly good at finding backroutes. So far, I've had a look through your levels and haven't managed to spot any, let alone find the intended solutions!

I'll come back at some point and have a proper go at it now I know what the difficulty level of the pack is. In the meantime, keep at it if you enjoy it!

ericderkovits · September 20, 2020, 08:38:39 PM

ok, I downloaded these 20 levels (.nxlv), but they weren't in a pack so i used the pack tool kit to pack them into a pack.

some of the levels music was missing, so for those it just plays the standard amiga music.

I wanted to add custom music for the missing ones but for some reason opening any of the .nxlv levels posted crashes in the editor(

)

anyways just extract this to your neolemmix main folder

also here are the replays if you want them(Thanks Icho)