Revenge of the Lemmings (conversion to v12.7) community help appreciated :)

Started by Flopsy, January 06, 2020, 02:41:56 AM

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Crane

Here's a rehashed crystal version of The Top Shelf (Armageddon 16).

  • Lemming count reduced from 80 to 30 - you can only lose one lemming.
  • You can now walk to the top platform from the left.
  • The "shelf" on the left now has a block in the middle of it, replacing the wall on the left (in any way, climbers going over it will die).
  • Increased Bomber and Blocker count to 5.
  • Made the starting floor thicker.

ADDENDUM:

Turns out that there's a major backroute and I didn't properly accommodate for it - made two additional changes to fix it:

  • Lemming count reduced from 30 to 20 - you can still only lose one lemming.
  • Release Rate increased from 72 to 80.

Crane

A fix of "A Bid Farewell" that repositions the trapdoor and exit to their original positions (I had moved them for the Christmas version of this level).

I also forgot to mention that there's an extra bit of terrain on the steel plates below the one-way wall, so Lemmings can walk up over it.  This helps patch a backroute.  I don't know the full intended solution, but I do recall reading part of an interview with the level author once over a decade ago, and he mentions...
Spoiler
...the difficulty of using a single Builder to bridge three separate points.

The time limit reduction down to 3:30 may be unnecessary.  I can't remember what backroute it's meant to block now, but if it's deemed not to be a concern, it can be upped to 4:00 again.  I'll let Proxima decide when he comes to the level.

ADDENDUM: If anyone wants to try it or think it might work better as a final level for a rank, here's the Christmas version of the level as well!

Crane

I patched up The Floodgates Open to change the author's name from Clam to Clam Spammer, if just for the sake of consistency, and to restore the music track it used in Revenge of the Lemmings.

:tal-gold: I also put in the 3-minute time limit as a gold talisman named "617 Squadron", an oblique reference to the Dam Busters.

ADDENDUM: Alternative names "Dam Busters", "Operation Chastise", "Tidal Bore".

Crane

A backroute fix for "JAILBREAK!" and "Sharing a Climber?", and a deadly ceiling fix for "One Step Off".

ADDENDUM: For those curious, this is the major backroute that I fixed in "Spiralling Snowstorm".

Proxima

Feedback and replays through the end of Pain. Just two levels here I haven't solved yet (22 Herculems and 25 Pipe Dream) but I thought I should post feedback anyway.

Proxima

Remake of The Hotel in Hell. I believe that's all of my levels done :thumbsup:

EDIT: Set time limit to 2 minutes and added another fireblower, to fix backroutes found by namida.

EDIT 2: Slightly lowered one platform to make execution a bit nicer, at namida's suggestion.

Crane

Yeah, your solution to "A Bid Farewell" looks intended - I forgot about that one, since my own solution is a kind of backroute that saves a basher, although my own fixes to the level forces you to use all 6.  I can't remember what backroute the reduced timer is meant to patch, but I vaguely remember saving 2 bashers somehow.

NOTE: The replay is meant for the version that came with RotL, not my modified versions.

With your approval, I will up the time limit on my modified versions back to 4 minutes, and also increase the time limit of "That Freezing Feeling" to 4 minutes as well so we stick with round time limits.

Crane

"A Bid Farewell" and "That Freezing Feeling" with time limits set to 4 minutes.

Crane

Here are the original versions of "The Shaft", with a couple of extra twists, taking advantage of the ability to mix tilesets and flip and rotate pieces.

Also reduced the time limit on the first Shaft from 10 minutes to 9 minutes to it better abides by the rules of a "traditional" level.

Crane

"Betcha can't save just one!" with the RotL music and a talisman to boot!

Dullstar

Quote from: namida on January 06, 2020, 05:36:05 PM
All the music for RotL is tracker formats (MOD, IT, etc), so someone familiar with OpenMPT (or a similar app) should be able to handle this part of things. It's pretty much a matter of finding the appropriate point to jump to, and adding a "Pattern break" and "Position jump" command. I might make a tutorial at some point.

I saw this scrolling through the thread, and I don't get the impression this has been resolved. Technically, it's very straightforward.

There are a few issues that complicate things a bit. All of the files have the extension .it for some reason, regardless of whether or not they are actually .it files, though OpenMPT seems to be able to figure out what they actually are somehow. track_02, for example, is actually a .mod. This has to be checked before a pattern break can be used, since this effect depends on the format. Another problem is that, since some of these weren't designed with looping in mind, some don't really have good loop points to work with, though it's still often possible to clean up the restart process a bit so it sounds less abrupt. track_02, for example again, has a long silence after it finishes but before it restarts, and if you trim that silence out it loops reasonably well, though if you're actively listening it for it it's pretty obvious where it's looping (it sounds fine, at least, so it's not like it's an abrupt cut-off or anything).

Since there are 48 tracks, I don't plan on going through each of them and checking the looping, but I can try to make functional loops for anything brought to my attention.

Also, here are instructions if someone wants to try it themselves. These are a bit more informative than namida's, though still not quite at the level of being useful for someone who's never used a tracker before. It does explain the commands, but assumes you know how to input them, for example.
Instructions
First, some quick terminology: patterns are basically sets of note data; patterns are made of rows; the pattern order determines what patterns will be played when; the position is where the song is in the pattern order. As namida stated, they should only require position jump (Bxx in .it/.xm/.mod, where xx is the position number in hex) and maybe pattern break (Cxx in .it, Dxx in .xm/.mod, where xx is the row number in hex of the next pattern). These effects should be placed on the last row you want to be heard before the jump (any data in the rest of the pattern will be skipped), and target the first row/pattern you want to play. The effects can be used together to target a specific row/position, but if you just need to jump to the start of a different pattern, Bxx can be used without it being necessary to specify C00. If Cxx is used, but Bxx is not specified, the next position will be assumed.

namida

QuoteAll of the files have the extension .it for some reason, regardless of whether or not they are actually .it files, though OpenMPT seems to be able to figure out what they actually are somehow. track_02, for example, is actually a .mod. This has to be checked before a pattern break can be used, since this effect depends on the format.

A long time ago, NeoLemmix only looked for "IT" and "OGG" extensions, even though it supported all the formats it does now if you changed their extension to the most similar out of those two. This has long since been resolved, but ROTL's music was compiled before this was fixed.
My projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)
Non-Lemmings: Commander Keen: Galaxy Reimagined (a Commander Keen fangame)

Dullstar

I'll probably eventually be able to get through all of the tracks simply by playing them while working on other things, but it will take a while, since there are 48 of them.

Here's what I've got so far. Probably won't upload anything until it's done.

No work required:
Already loops/restarts non-distractingly: [1, 3, 4, 9, 11, 12]

Work needed
Does not loop cleanly: [5, 6, 7, 8, 10]
Unchecked: [13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48]

Done
Done: [2]

Correct extension list (items on the unchecked list from above are omitted here)
.mod: [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12]

Notes

10: Doesn't loop cleanly but ending is very similar to the introduction - should make for easy looping.

Crane

Fixed versions of Nemesis and its easier version, Dream Eater (besides matching the scenery, I increaed the rescue limit from 60 to 72 so it's more Tricky-like).

Also find "The Duct Rise Lemmings" restored to the first version (it looks neater in my opinion even though mechanically it's completely identical) and also another copy of "The Top Shelf" that has a different choice of music track (using track 01, which doesn't see much use in the later ranks).

Crane

- Fixed "Training Zone Alpha" and "Training Zone Omega".
- Made some minor terrain changes to "Food for the Gods" and "Finding a place to stay" to account for the higher-precision Blockers that didn't exist in the original Lemming.
- This is a Gate Level has had its deadly ceiling fixed.