Level Design Contest #19 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)

[Crane]

In the meantime, here are my current solutions to a load of miscellaneous level.  Some look like backroutes.

Spoiler

In this replay, you have only saved 1 out of 5 Lemmings required.

I did accidentally save some failed attempts into the ZIP.

[Crane]

Doesn't the Sandopolis tileset have steel terrain pieces? I feel they would be neater as platforms than the one-way up arrows.

[Flopsy]

As expected IchoTolot's solution is yet again a back route. I didn't even know a shimmier could do that!

[Dullstar]

Icho's solution is a backroute, but definitely an interesting one. I will still try to fix it, but it might not be the worst thing if it can't be resolved.

[Armani]

@Flopsy

How about this ??
This time, I used shimmier as it meant to be used normally.
Attached replay is for v10.

[Flopsy]

@Flopsy

How about this ??
This time, I used shimmier as it meant to be used normally.
Attached replay is for v10.

We finally have an intended solution, thanks a lot Armani

[IchoTolot]

Resolved the 3 updated level.

I am sure Dullstar's level is intended now and I love the solution!

In Flopsy's level I now got a shimmier and a miner leftover.

[Dullstar]

IchoTolot's solution to Shimmier Sort is an acceptable variant.

Discussion of IchoTolot's Solution

I didn't realize that the walker could be used to save a cloner early on, but it's compensated by needing to use the cloner to get a lemming facing the correct direction later. This is secondary to the actual puzzle, so I don't think enforcing the "correct" order would improve the level, thus I consider it an acceptable variant.

A bit of developer commentary on the level (warning: may contain minor solution hints)

It's been a while
When I started the level, my design goal was to have a level featuring a shimmier at the beginning, which would be cloned at different times to create lemmings with different combinations of permanent skills. I settled somewhat early on with making a climber/floater and climber/glider, but I had a bit of difficulty deciding how to enforce this. This is why the button is where it is, although it took me several tries to get the design right due to a bit of tunnel vision with the solution - I got so used to using certain skills in certain places that I wasn't thinking of other places I could maybe use them! The idea was that a glider would glide off the climbable obstacle and therefore miss the button, while a floater would hit the button. The locked exit, thus, wasn't something that was planned from the start - it was only added as a way to make sure both a floater and glider were required. Several ways of bypassing this obstacle were found, which was a bit frustrating for me to fix, because I needed to find a way to prevent players from bypassing the puzzle elements by bashing through things they weren't supposed to bash through, but I also wanted things to look decent, which limited how much I could use steel. I also designed the level to be a one-screener at a 1920x1080 resolution, which meant that fixes needed to be compact. Part of me feels compelled to make sure the level is either small enough to fit on one screen or big enough to justify requiring the player to scroll.

It's been a while since I participated in one of the design contests. I often have trouble coming up with any compelling ideas for the contests (or levels in general, for that matter), but early on with Rule 3 I was able to come up with a vague idea that I thought might be workable. When I was younger I used to put out a high volume of levels, but most of them were bad. I think now, even though my level quantity is much lower, my level quality has improved greatly - at least once all the backroutes are found and patched!

Realistically, the best thing about submitting a level to the contest, in my opinion, is the feedback you can get for an individual level. Levels in the Random Level Sharing thread tend not to get much attention, and creating an entire pack's worth of levels can take a while, so the contest is a good way to practice, find out what people like and don't like, and start getting a feel for what people do to break your level so you can get better at testing.

[Flopsy]

I'm streaming the contest levels later today in just under 6 hours on my YouTube channel

Hope to see you all there

[IchoTolot]

Flopsy's Stream is online now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zARkEfz8OFQ

[Flopsy]

Thanks to everyone who dropped by to watch the stream.

For those who missed it, I am now going to post feedback for levels and my replay files.

Spoiler

Rule 1

Armani's Supernova - What can I say, this solution was truly difficult to spot. I honestly couldn't believe the solution when I found it and I think it is 100% intended. I didn't say positive things on the stream (don't worry nothing negative either) but looking back, this was one of the better ones in the pack! Good effort, welcome to the Lemmings community!

Crane's T.E.E.T.H - No solve, I'm sorry if I was overly critical of this level, no hard feelings

namida's Reach Around - I really liked the return to what made Lemmings Plus packs so great, this one really had me stumped for a while but in a good way, the steel really threw me off and I was trying to make it part of the solution for a long time. One of the better levels in the contest.

NieSch's Perpetuum Mobilem - This one caught me out and I thought I solved it before the infinite loop on the teleport brought me down to Earth again! This was another nice level, it was very hard to solve!

WillLem's Day of the Daredevils part 1 - This was a nice little puzzle to finish the rank off, very reminiscent of my LP of your Xmas Lemmings pack

Rule 2

IchoTolot's It's the name of the fame - This was a great level by you, I actually enjoyed it once I got going on it, very interesting non contruction skill level

Rule 3

Armani's I'll be back for sure - I'm pretty sure this is a back route but it did use pretty much all of the skills, I did enjoy trying to solve this for what it is worth, very nice concept for a level.

Crane's SCROOGE - Did not even attempt this, I did not want to be raging mad during the stream and the zombies were a sure fire way to make me rage. Sorry.

Dullstar's Shimmier Sort - I did get a lot of help with this one but I did really like the solution once it fell into place. I don't think I would have solve this without help though, as with Crane, I don't tend to solve your levels either most of the time!

IchoTolot's Xeno Menace - Didn't spend much time on this, it was too Hard for Flopsy for my liking and I was short on time. No solve.

NieSch's Me, Myself and I - This was a very tight level to beat in the time limit, you were there to watch me play it anyway. I did enjoy it in the end and it was a great level overall.

SQron's Llandri Ironworks and Nuclear Fission - I didn't spend much time on this either, I didn't understand how to even approach this one. Your levels have really been getting much harder in recent contests and I have not been able to solve your contest levels as of late. This may or may not be a compliment, this level was ok but I struggled with it. No solve.

WillLem's Day of the DareDevil's part 2 - This was the last level of the stream and it felt very similar to your Rule 1 level, you would have been better off not submitting this level again for a different rule but that is just my opinion. It helped uplift me after being beaten by the 4 levels I couldn't solve though so positive for that!

[Armani]

@Flopsy
Thanks a lot for playing my levels Flopsy!
And thank you for all your feedback, comments, and also welcoming!
If I had known you were streaming yesterday, I would have definitely been there. So sad.
I will watch video on your youtube channel soon.
Your solution to my rule1 level is 100% intended and as you expected, your solution for rule3 is not intended. But somewhat close to intended.




Some comments on my levels to everyone.

I'm serving in the military now and two weeks of furlough ends tommorow.(There is mandatory draft system in my country.)
I can still read and post comments but I cannot watch replays or update my levels.
So I'm sorry that I can't give any comments and feedback about my and other people's levels anymore.
So here I attached intended solution for my two levels.
"Supernova" is for v2 and "I'll be back for sure" is for v3.
I hope all of you enjoy the remaining contest.

[IchoTolot]

I resolved the updated levels. I think more levels are intended now.

I attached my up-to-date replay collction.

[WillLem]

I can't even get past Armani's Supernova!!

Gonna have another go at this tomorrow. Sleep time now!

[Flopsy]

I resolved the updated levels. I think more levels are intended now.

I attached my up-to-date replay collction.

Well done, the best news I've had today is I don't need to fix Who Ya Gonna Call this time
100% intended solution.