[NL 12.7.0+] Lemmings Destination [Difficulty: Medium-Very Hard]

[kaywhyn]

Xenon rank completed, so I'm back with more replays and feedback.

Xenon Rank Feedback

While I kind of breezed through the first 3 ranks of the pack, the Xenon rank was where solving times finally slowed considerably for me, as there were a lot of difficult levels for me. I think what happened was that I did ok for the first 5 levels or so, and then it came to the point where I could only get 1 or 2 levels solved per video, as well as multiple levels needing more than one video to solve. Luckily, I haven't had to switch to off-camera time yet (I start doing this if I'm not able to get the same level solved after two recorded videos), but this might start becoming true for some Radon levels.

Spoiler

Xenon 1 - Hikers Probably a slight backroute, since I do have some skills leftover and it was also completely timing based.

Xenon 2 - Snow Patrol I already said this before in the LP video description, and I believe this still remains true even after seeing all of the Xenon rank, this is my biggest favorite of the entire rank. This was the extremely good kind of challenging that was very satisfying to figure out and solve. Tihs level does a very good job of making you think certain skills "must" go at a particular location. For example, for a long time I kept thinking a digger needed to be used on the first one-way pillar. There were a lot of things that caught me off guard, most notably how to  get around the problem of the climber going out to the right and dying, since we need to save everyone. Once again, incorrect sequencing of skills got me into trouble. The key was realizing that everyone must be collected right above the basher tunnel before bashing to the left. Just a very well done level here, Nessy!

Xenon 3 - Security Weak Spot Easier than the previous level, but still can be a bit difficult. I would say I was kind of a dummy here and kept thinking all the builders needed to be used on the left side of the level.

Xenon 4 - Transcendence Nice builderless level that isn't hard level, but it can still be challenging. I kept thinking that the worker needs to be turned back to the left before dropping down on the right side of the structure at the bottom when all it took was just simply digging and dropping on the left side of it.

Xenon 5 - Ghosts In A Machine This one also wasn't as bad as I thought. Compression for the win on the right side, while turning the other lemmings around to the left by blocking after letting a certain number of them go out to the right with the left entrance.

Xenon 6 - They Complain About Blockades The first level of the rank to surprisingly stump me badly. It was very difficult to know whether you can hold back the crowd or if you need to keep it moving. The closest I came to solving the level was using a builder staircase to keep a basher going, but unfortunately the climber gets lost this way, along with another lemming that drowns in the water, therefore leaving you one short of the requirement. It was also hard to see building at the top of the OWW to turn the climber around. Before this, I kept digging it in such a way so that some pixel of wall to the right was left, therefore forcing me to use either a basher or a builder to turn him around. That definitely took me a while. Also, it took me a while to see how to stop the climber from going to the left and drowning in the water. Took a while to see where to finally start containing the crowd. I must say that's clever with bombing the left side so that no one can go out to the left and then blocking on the right to contain everyone.

Xenon 7 - Super Lemming 2D World Easier than the previous one, but still challenging. I don't think my solution is exactly intended, but it's probably still acceptable. I used a miner to stall one of the lemmings to give the lead enough time to build over the gap to the exit before anyone arrives and falls to the bottomless pit.

Xenon 8 - Life With Mystery This one should be a backroute, since I'm sure I cheesed this level completely. Perhaps building to raise the wall high enough so that everyone is contained between the large wall and the slanted terrain is unintended?

Xenon 9 - NessyTV Presents... Easier than the previous level. This one seems open-ended, so there's probably no one intended solution? Shame that the second billboard needed to be destroyed a bit

Xenon 10 - Time For A Factory Reset Second level of the rank to stump me, surprisingly. I used the extremely timing heavy and fiddly method of blocking at the end of the fencer tunnel so that he turns around while in the middle of his swinging animation in order to break the ceiling for the left crowd to get into it. I feel this is just too cool to break I'm actually surprised that it works, although at the same time the miner also has to be placed very precisely. I watched Icho's solution after I solved this level, and I seriously can't believe I never saw to platform for a bit after the fencer breaks through so that only a digger is needed to merge the left entrance with the right one I feel really dumb for not seeing that.

Xenon 11 - Instant Ninjas Yet another level of the rank that stumped me. My solution seemed somewhat messy and fiddly. Just like the previous one, I watched Icho's solution after I solved this level, and my reaction was, "Wait, I had the solution correct the entire time, I just didn't go far enough with it?" I think it was mostly due to how before I used a miner to delay the second lemming that goes to the bottom with the worker and hence I confused myself, especially since after making the miner tunnel for the crowd there's the tiny gap to the right where the floating steel blocks are and that I needed either another platformer or a blocker to turn them back towards the exit. Not to mention other stuff I kept trying so that I would always be a skill short.

Xenon 12 - Lem Me Go Next Easier than the previous level. Parts of my solution "feel" unintended here?

Xenon 13 - Freeze Frame This seems to be a big backroute. I don't think it's supposed to be this easy! Also, I have a lot of skills leftover.

Xenon 14 - Tether Circus Level Another favorite of mine even if my solution appears to be a slight backroute, since I have a builder and a digger leftover, or if acceptable, seems more efficient than the intended one. Still a challenging one even after having most of the level figured out fairly quickly.

Xenon 15 - When Push Comes To Shove I thought this one was easy. Seems easy for its position late in the rank. Only technicality I forgot about was needing to save the blocker and that's when I realized the digger is needed

Xenon 16 - I Am The Doorway Probably a little easier than the previous one. I think the only hard part here is seeing that a lemming inside the digger pit needs to climb out to the left. Maybe a slight backroute here? I went 1 over the requirement too. Even if it is, the intended solution probably still makes the level easy.

Xenon 17 - The Capital Of Science Definitely harder than the previous two levels. However, this is another favorite of mine. Leaving a builder step past a thin wall so that the climbers will survive to the bottom was clever. Here, it took me a while to see where the miner needs to be used. I kept thinking it was on the thin platform to the left of the huge bridge-like structure instead of at the top. Also using a builder staircase to keep a miner going and bombing a climber to make the wall low enough for everyone to walk into the exit. Very good level that uses these three tricks!

Xenon 18 - Night Surf This one wasn't as hard as the previous one, but this one took me a while only because I kept trying something that just kept failing but I still had the belief that it would work despite me rejecting it as not working for good a few times in the video. I simply kept losing two to the stomper trap, but I still believed that it can be made to work so that only one gets killed. Indeed, the key was the maxing out the RR for the last few lemmings. Even then, this one doesn't seem intended, particularly since I have plenty of skills leftover. Something tells me that the intended solution involves falling through to the bottom right before the stomper trap on the right side?

Xenon 19 - It Bee Like That Sometimes Another really good level. That's really clever with building at the edge in such a way so that the worker turns around after leaving just a single brick (how I managed to save a builder in Xenon 14), as well as a builder step past the thin wall so to break the fall for the climber so he will survive the fall to the bottom. I can still see how this can be challenging, but I didn't think the level was hard.

Xenon 20 - Blue Wedding Nice 2-of-everything level to close off the Xenon rank. Once more, it's nowhere near the hardest level of the rank. There were much harder levels earlier in the rank that I struggled with. This one seems open-ended, so there's probably not an intended solution here.   

So far, I've only played and solved the first 4 levels of Radon, and I got to say so far save for Radon 3 all of them were favorites with me. Nothing too difficult in the rank yet, but I'm sure that will change shortly. Yup, this pack is definitely many times better than Migration I'm just surprised at how fast I'm breezing through the pack.

I'll be back with more replays and feedback once I finish the Radon rank!

[kaywhyn]

Radon rank completed! More replays and feedback, as usual.

Spoiler

Radon Rank Feedback

Truthfully, I actually found the Radon rank somewhat easier than the Xenon rank. I honestly thought I was going to be stuck even harder here in the rank than I was in the Xenon rank. Then again, to be fair, I likely still found a lot of backroutes in the Radon rank

Spoiler

Radon 1 - Brave Explorers Wanted To start off the rank, this was one of my favorites! That's really clever using a passthrough blocker underneath the left entrance and then releasing with a digger with a lemming that drops on top of him. This I say is the hardest to see in the level.

Radon 2 - Magic To Make A Sane Lem Go Mad Another favorite of mine. Maybe a slight backroute, since I do have some skills leftover. Or, if it is acceptable, probably more efficient than the intended solution. It was still really challenging, though!

Radon 3 - The Hanger Definitely harder than the previous two levels. Getting the crowd down safely is certainly the hardest part. It also took me a while to see to dig first near the exit before mining to the right so that another digger right where the first shaft is will prevent climbers from going out to the left and hence can exit.

Radon 4 - Nightcrawler Yet another favorite level of mine! I especially love the trick of using a miner to crave a hole in the wall twice so that a climber can get in there to start bashing. Also with using the pit in the bottom left to climb into and making a splatform for the crowd. The hardest part in the level is timing the climbers so that the second one can turn around while the basher tunnel is in progress to mine the crowd out twice. This requires that the basher is sufficiently far out first. Very nicely done with this level, Nessy!

Radon 5 - Mystic Crossing Ahead Looks simple, but is deceivingly difficult. I ended up struggling longer than I thought. A lot of my earlier attempts kept failing by at least a pixel or I would be a skill short. Then I came back to trying to stall the third lemming long enough for the builder to get his job done before he can slip by, but unfortunately he is too slow by a brick. I passed due to using the trick of bombing high enough on the first pole so that lemmings coming from the left can step up but is too high on the right side so that no lemmings can go out to the left. I totally forgot about this property of straight edge terrain in regards to climber bombing. I watched Icho's solution after I solved this, and I seriously can't believe I completely overlooked the very simple use two bombers to get the right crowd out.

I will say that I loved the visuals in this level though, considering that green is my favorite color!

Radon 6 - A Mind Of My Own This solution might be a backroute, as I'm guessing the level should be harder than that. Or, if the solution is acceptable, then it seems more efficient than the intended one, especially since I saved a blocker too.

Radon 7 - Sanctum Deceivingly difficult one. I don't know if raising the wall with a builder on the right side of the digger pit is intended, though. I also used a basher as a stalling tactic so that neither of the two clumped lemmings slip out.

Radon 8 - Suspension Bridge This is likely a huge backroute, considering I don't use any of the climbers but one

Radon 9 - What's It Like Up There? One of my favorites. I pretty much had all of the solution except for how to use the blocker so that no one from the right entrance goes out to the left. It took me a while to see that the basher will be faster than the rate at which lemmings come out of the entrances, so therefore at some point everyone will be going to the right

Radon 10 - The Weirder Side Of Things Another deceivingly hard one. My solution uses some precision with the basher so that he still punches through some of the slanted terrain to free the crowd trapped where the bottom half of the OWW is. I also used a miner to hit steel to turn the climber around so that he can quickly get the button before the crowd can slip past the locked exit. I'm guessing these two skill usages are unintended?

Radon 11 - Wanderlust Not as hard as I thought. Pretty much had the solution at one point, only to realize that I wouldn't meet the save requirement. Then I realized I could salvage the solution by digging a blocker free and then cancelling the digger with a blocker.

Radon 12 - Pit And Wit The level totally screamed out "nuke solution" to me. After a few attempts I realized that it wasn't going to work no matter what, as the lemmings just get the timer too soon and hence don't have enough time to get to the exit. Seems like my solution is pretty much similar to Icho, only I like his better, as my bomber assignment is super precise.

Radon 13 - Cannibal Festival Yet another huge favorite of mine. I thought that's really clever of freeing the blocker with a miner on a builder staircase that doesn't quite reach the wall. My only gripe here is how the buckets of water can easily be mistaken for solid terrain when they're actually background. I certainly remember being taken surprised by this when I first played levels in this tileset on Old Formats NL (I think it was Raylem's pack?), so I likely simply have forgotten about it since.

Radon 14 - Breaking The Fourth Wall Yet another favorite of mine! That's really clever with building in such a way so that the lemming turns around after finishing bashing so that the crowd at the top breaks their fall by first falling onto that, and then being able to land on the second builder staircase further below the builder step. The only hard part is timing the climbers so that they slip by the first builder in progress and he finishes so that the climbers hit their nose/head and fall back down.

Radon 15 - In Case Of Emergency... Somewhat difficult. I nearly had the solution at one point, it was just figuring out how to stop the other climbers from dying and going up at the top with the worker. I used some RR manipulation to get the timings right. Knowing myself, there's likely a much easier solution.

Radon 16 - City Escape Besides Radon 19, this was the hardest level for me in the entire rank, in large part because I tend to be very bad with stackers. I don't know if stacking on a builder staircase in progress so that the stacker turns around is intended, though. Also the part near the end on how to free the crowd with a miner is very hard to see, along with bombing a faller and then digging to get low enough and still be able to build to the exit to turn around and then climb up the digger shaft to mine them free.

Radon 17 - Dove In An Elevator I believe I know the Dovelems level you're referring to in the title here. I believe it was a Snow level? This was yet another favorite of mine. I really like the tricks of leaving a builder step past a thin wall to send out a climber to the right and survive the fall to the bottom to get to the gap before the others, as well as using builder staircases to keep a mining going and also bouncing him off the blocker. The latter was the hardest to see in this level.

Radon 18 - Unbreakable Yet another favorite of mine. The methods to leave a builder step past a wall twice here are quite clever. The first involve bombing the snow pillar and then climbing into the bomber hole to leave the builder step, while the second one involves bashing in such a way so that near the other end of the wall a thin sliver of the pillar is left so that the basher can leave a builder step past it to serve as a splatform for the left entrance.

Radon 19 - Eulogy Of Surrealism Very deceptively difficult level despite the very minimal skillset. Here, I used the extremely timing heavy and very fiddly method of bashing and then blocking on the raised terrain so that the blocker can be released later with a basher. I watched Icho's solution after solving, and as I suspected, my very fiddly method is not required at all. I'm not even sure if I be able to eventually stumble upon this solution on my own, actually. As for my solution, I can imagine it will be extremely difficult or just downright impossible to block and therefore will unfortunately will have to be acceptable.

Radon 20 - Final Destination Definitely nowhere near the hardest level of the rank, but it's still very challenging. Near the end, I kept running into either skill shortages or I would be short of the save requirement. I eventually found this solution which pretty much uses all skills except for several diggers.

All that remains is the Synthetic rank. I can't imagine this one taking a very long time, so I might be able to finish it later tonight and hence the LP of the pack. Or, if not, then sometime tomorrow.

[kaywhyn]

Hi Nessy,

And, Synthetic rank completed and hence I have solved all of Lemmings Destination v1.2. I have attached my entire replay collection for the pack. As I have already given feedback on all the other ranks, this post will be feedback for the Synthetic rank.

Synthetic Rank Feedback

Wow, these contest levels were really good. Before I played this rank, the only contest levels of yours I have played from a while ago were "Excavation Site" (currently the final level of Lemmings Migration, which I LPed almost a year ago) and "Abandoned Memory" (LDC #21). I've also played your LDC #22 contest level from a few months ago, but it's not in this rank, and I believe the reason for that is simply due to the pack being released long before you made your R1 for LDC #22.

In contrast to the 5 main ranks of the pack, the rank already starts off with a high difficulty. As a matter of fact, I consider Synthetic 9 as the only easy level of the rank. The rest of them were quite challenging. Also, it seems that the levels here were simply ordered from oldest contest to most recent contest.

Spoiler

Synthetic 1 - Excavation Site I originally found a much messier solution for the level when I LPed your Migration pack, but I decided to find another solution as I don't like my own solution I found from almost a year ago. This one is a much cleaner solution, where it doesn't rely on using builder staircases to keep the first basher going, and the basher beating the crowd to the second gap before anyone falls through to the bottomless pit. When I first played the level, the save requirement was what got me into trouble, as I kept thinking everyone needs to be saved, when you're allowed to lose 1. I guess it's due to me internalizing that everyone needs to be saved, so anytime I play a level where you don't need a "save all" solution I will occasionally forget that it's necessary to do so.

Synthetic 2 - Guardians Of The Hero's Shrine This is surprisingly a difficult level despite being a 1-of-everything! Not a bad thing, as I tend to like these types of levels. They can be difficult if done correctly. I watched Icho's solution to this level after I solved it, and as I suspected my very timing heavy solution is not necessary at all. Here, I simply had two right-most lemmings timed in such a way so that one of them turns back to the right just as the builder finishes sealing off the gap to the left and quickly digging through the staircase so that everyone can fall and walk to the exit. I honestly can't believe I didn't see a much easier solution here.

Synthetic 3 - Journey One of my favorites of the pack! This was a difficult level but very satisfying to figure out. Before I found the solution, I kept running into problems thinking about how to get a worker out to the right side to forge the path, as well as getting around skill shortages. It was very hard to see to send two lemmings through the ghostbuster trap so that you get your worker lemming. Also seeing to use a walker to free a blocker, as even the simplest application of a walker skill can easily be overlooked or not even thought of doing. Once again, the trick of leaving a builder step to make a splatform for the top crowd returns here.

Synthetic 4 - Turbulent Turnpike Act 1 I also surprisingly struggled with this one. Seems like I came up with quite a messy solution that doesn't even use the second miner pickup. Once again, I can't believe I didn't see the solution that Icho used.

Synthetic 5 - Turbulent Turnpike Act 2 Had I known that I hadn't ran long yet on the previous level, I would had taken on this sequel in the same video as Synthetic 4. This one didn't take me as long as the former, but this one was still a hard one. Getting the lemmings up is certainly the hardest part. I thought I was going to be here a while, as this brought back bad memories of playing Icho's Laboratory D-E-S-C-E-N-T and Laboratory A-S-C-E-N-T from his United pack. Actually, that sounded worse than it does. Here I am referring to how I used extremely messy and timing heavy solutions to both of his levels. Now those were a nightmare to find and execute

Synthetic 6 - How To Self-Destruct A Factory Nice level, and a well-designed one at that with the tileset. That's really neat with bombing a wrong OWW and still being able to bash through a little at a time to get through. As weird as it is, that seems to be intended? I think you would run out of time otherwise.

Synthetic 7 - Butterfly Cult Now this should be the biggest backroute of the rank I solved the level by ignoring the left-most entrance completely. There were a couple of times in the LP that I stated that ignoring the left-most entrance doesn't work after seeing how my attempts to do kept failing by at least a pixel or come up some skills short, but I ultimately got it to work. That's some persistence on my end!

Synthetic 8 - A Quiet Place This was a really hard one but ultimately another huge favorite of mine of the rank! That was a very good complete red herring with the very thick wall at the top. At some point, I fortunately realized that you'll always be a destructive skill short if you attempt to go through it. The hardest part was figuring out how to get through the dragon statue with the swirling fire trap on its lower arm, as well as how to get through plenty of the other obstacles. I really like the Dolly Dimple variation here once more, and using a stacker to keep a basher going through both the block and lighthouse was very clever! It was also hard seeing that using a platformer and then climber bombing the final wall is enough to bash through and still be able to get to the exit.

This is also one of my favorite tilesets visually!

Synthetic 9 - Climb Every Green Hill As mentioned before, this was quite an easy level, as well as being the easiest level of the Synthetic rank. Once again, must get a climber to turn around while a basher tunnel is in progress in order to mine the crowd out. I was a dummy here and kept thinking to dig right on top of the palm tree, rather than just before it so that no one goes splat.

Synthetic 10 - Built to Rule The World Another hard one but once more a favorite of mine! For a while, I had most of the solution all figured out, but I still needed to work out how to get through the final pole the crowd gets to before they can keep walking out to the right. It was very hard to see leaving a builder step and blocking on it and to bomb with another climber so that it releases the blocker while having the other climber go out to the left to mine the crowd out. Timing the two climbers to achieve this is the hardest part. Otherwise, very nice solution, especially with platforming at the top, blocking to turn the other climber around, digging through it, and then climbing into the pit between the two poles very close to each other which can both be destroyed with a single bomber. Very clever level!

Synthetic 11 - Abandoned Memory To round off the entire Destination pack is a contest level of yours that I have already played, as LDC #21 is the very first one I participated in as a level solver. Still, the huge passage of time means that I have definitely forgotten the solution I found since, as well as other solutions that I have seen for the level. In any case, I still ended up using the solution I originally found, although by manually attempting to recreate it instead of just loading a replay. I find it very interesting that the first and final levels of the Synthetic rank are bookends in that these two are the only ones of the rank I have played before playing Lemmings Destination.   

Overall, excellent job on a very well-done pack! Lemmings Destination is just many times better than Migration, and now that I have solved the entire pack, I declare Destination a big favorite pack of mine! This definitely earns a spot on my list of all-time favorite level packs. I am surprised that I didn't struggle with Destination as I thought I would, considering that I really struggled with Migration. Then again, it's almost been a year since I LPed Migration, and I have LPed many level packs between doing Migration and now just finishing Destination. So, perhaps it's all the experience I've gained from LPing all those level packs? Or, perhaps more likely, it's due to how I'm very used to your style of small to medium size levels with very minimal skillsets to create a deceivingly difficult level even though it's almost been a year since I played Migration. Besides Migration, there were only 3 other contest levels of yours I have played. Now that I've played through all of the Synthetic rank, I have now officially played all of your contest levels at least once. If playing your most recent contest entries is any indication, I know they're hard, but I didn't think your really early ones would be very difficult as well! So, it seems that you were always really good with making very hard levels from the get-go. Not a bad thing at all, at least with me, as I love difficult levels, especially the good kind of difficult, where they're very satisfying to sit through and figure out.

I hope you're doing well and that you have been enjoying the LP of your pack if you been watching. I look forward to comments on my solutions if you're planning on doing so, and I hope that follows through with Migration as well. I'm always more than happy to give level designers feedback as well. With this LP, we now officially have one full complete playthrough of Lemmings Destination online!

Hope to see you at future Jackbox sessions as well. It was great fun having you with us in the previous session