[NeoLemmix] NeoLemmix Introduction Pack

[IchoTolot]

Ah - is this set to automatically assign whichever key the user has specified as the hotkey to the text? In that case, this makes sense as I've assigned time-skipping duties to mouse clicks (L-forward 1 frame/R-backward 1 frame) rather than keys. Would this explain the issue?

Exactly.

[joshescue18]

I have completed the pack so far.

[namida]

I have completed the pack so far.

This is the kind of pack where just giving replays without any further feedback really isn't all that useful. The goal of this pack is to introduce new players to NeoLemmix, so comments on how well it does that (or what could be improved in regards to that) are much more helpful than replays here. Of course, other feedback is almost always useful; but this pack is unique in that it's the more important aspect.

[WillLem]

It's a great pack, there are some enjoyable levels and as a NeoLemmix beginner I have found it really useful in getting to grips with some of the new skills - there's no way I could have taken on the all-new-skills challenge without having had a look at this pack first (or, I would have struggled a lot with it at first).

Constructive feedback: I'd just look again at the pre-screens and make sure that they're as clear as possible. I've noticed a few typos and mis-wordings (some examples below):

Spoiler

Before Blocker Rocker: "Blocker are an effective way of containing the crowd, so that a single worker Lemming can create a save way to the exit..."

"Walkers can be used to turn blocker into a normal walker again..."

Before Top-Down Approach: "Bashers won't stop when encountering a slight steel slope as they can going SLIGHTLY upwards or downwards." - should this read "...as they can continue going..."?

"When giving them a shimmier close to the ceiling they won't fall down and transition into a shimmier instead. The syntax of this, if misread, implies that they won't "fall down and transition into a shimmier". It's nitpicking, perhaps, but these things need to be very clear to avoid confusion.

I'm happy to proof-read all of the pre-screen texts for you if you'd prefer to delegate this particular task elsewhere; PM them to me and I'll have a look as soon as I get the chance.

Some positive feedback:

I think you do a great job of keeping the levels fun and interesting whilst also presenting enough of a challenge so they don't just feel like boring tutorial levels. The pack in general is great for this reason.

Favourite Levels:

Top-Down Approach takes a couple of looks to solve even though it's quite straightforward
The Reacharound is a great puzzle - took me a while to unlock the secret to this one
Chalk-Walk is a great concept, and a new one on me. It's inspired me to have a go at making a level like this
The Joy Of Sorting looks incredibly ominous at first glance, but it's just a question of making sure you do things in the correct order!
Blocked In Your Favour does a great job of combining the skills used in the previous few levels; takes a few looks to get right!
Double Down and Equal Distribution - probably my biggest favourites of the whole pack; I love cloners!
Fancy Fencer

I've attached replays for all the Basic Training levels - very much enjoyed playing through these.

[IchoTolot]

I completely forgot to respond to Willem. I've read the message and looked through the replays though.

V 0.14 is out!

A level has been added as the new rank 2 finisher:

- Neutral Response (Introduction to neutral lemmings)

This is the kind of pack where just giving replays without any further feedback really isn't all that useful. The goal of this pack is to introduce new players to NeoLemmix, so comments on how well it does that (or what could be improved in regards to that) are much more helpful than replays here. Of course, other feedback is almost always useful; but this pack is unique in that it's the more important aspect.

Well, it still resulted in this:

Backroute fixes:

- 3 20 (extra steel)
- 3 30 (extra fencer pick up)

I also patched up the spelling mistakes and slight unclarities Willem pointed out.

Thanks again for the feedback!

I'm happy to proof-read all of the pre-screen texts for you if you'd prefer to delegate this particular task elsewhere; PM them to me and I'll have a look as soon as I get the chance.

Will do that for rank 4.

[DireKrow]

I am a fairly new lemmings player. I've played Fun through Taxing of the original, but nothing else. Skills that weren't in the original are new to me. I thought I'd give my perspective as I play through.

General Comments:

Spoiler

- The visual style is great. All the stages look really good. I like that you used the original themes for Skills, but custom themes for later levels.

- From the perspective of a brand new lemmings player, I think the release rates are a little high across the board in Skills and Objects. See my second post in the thread for some elaboration.

- In pretexts, referencing the pixel counts feels. weird. I don't think it's more helpful than just saying that lemmings die if they fall too far, for example. Perhaps mention the 64 pixels thing when the ruler is introduced?

- There's some issues where for me, in the description, the hotkey says <None> even though I have a hotkey assigned. For example, go-to-next-shrugger is 8 by default, but the description prior to Big Steps Through The Snow just says <None>. Just thought I'd mention it. Also, highlight lemming is not right-click by default (as stated by the Highlights With A Safety Net pretext), it's actually Ctrl+Click.

Level specific comments:

Spoiler

Skills 1. Just Digging Into NeoLemmix - Great. I like that it clearly has spots where you should and shouldn't dig.

Skills 2. Let's Take A Bash At It! - Also great. I really like the fact you included a staircase to show that not all bashing targets are flat vertical walls. However, I'm not sure what the pillar above the staircase shows that the three pillars in the middle don't already.

Skills 3. Fence & Mine For a Diagonal Line - Good. I'd have made a stage slightly more forgiving, but it's probably fine.

Skills 4. Climb Up, Hang On, Get Along! - Another great one. I love how it demonstrates hanging from uneven ceilings and turning climbers around.

Skills 5. Block and Blow In The Snow - Good. I particularly like the the miniature puzzle at the end. A new player must figure out how to go down and turn around at the same time. For example, they might be tempted to put a blocker at the ice tip, only to realize it becomes useless when they the bomb the ice. Good learning opportunity. It's possible to complete this level without using any blockers, which might be unintended. See attachment.

Skills 6. A Float, A Glide, Puts Any Abyss Aside! - Simple but effective. I like that the player is forced to see both skills in action, since there's only 4 of each but 8 lemmings in total.

Skills 7. Building Flat and Building High - Cool, but too hard? I'd DEFINITELY let a new player get a feel for 1 bridge or 1 platformer at a time in a safe, convenient environment before asking them to chain multiple bridges together, build over water, or build through weirdly shaped terrain. It's important to master these skills ASAP, so maybe the trial by fire is warranted, but this stage definitely feels way tougher than anything else in the tier.

Skills 8. Stacks and Stones Saved Our Bones - Clever. I like that the skill counts forces you to use a stoner to block, and forces you to use a stacker at one of the upper ledges.

Skills 9. Amphibious Engineer Squad - Good. I like how it demonstrates that water can break long falls and that one disarmer can disarm multiple traps. What happens if a swimmer meets a wall, though?

Skills 10. Walking On The Cloner Cliffs - Don't like this one. The fact you can just walk the lemming to the exit and then spam clone in front of it feels really cheap. Doesn't really demonstrate what walkers or cloners can do.

Skills 11 They Can't Mash Us All! - Simple and effective. I like it.

Skills 12. Just Nuke Them! - Cool. I genuinely would not have thought to use nuke this way.

---

Objects 1. Up for a Walk? - Beautifully presented. I like (?) how it's designed to encourage use of fast forward.

Objects 2. Iron Anthill - A little overwhelming. I think the same concepts could have been taught with a smaller level. Looks fun to optimize, though.

Objects 3. Time Crime - Good. I like that it shows blockers can be used to save time rather than to avoid hazards.

Objects 4. Trap Roulette - Great. Really like the use of several themes here. Shows what different kinds of blocks and traps might look like.

Objects 5. Follow The Arrow! - Excellent and comprehensive. All four directions were covered, as well as the fact you can use bombers to go against the arrows. One of my favorites in the pack.

Objects 6. Set Your Priorities Right! - Cool. Took me a moment to realize I could assign bashers while the pit was still being dug.

Objects 7. Pick Them Up and Push Them Down - Very nice looking level. A nice introduction to its concepts, as well. Is there supposed to be a one pixel seam between the terrain and steel?

Objects 8. Split and Splat - Simple but effective. I like how it encourages the use of the ruler. The splitters are a fun touch.

Objects 9. Beam Them Over - Great. Fantastic presentation. At first, I wasn't sure about the claustrophobic digging, but I suspect you're using it to bunch the lemmings up so they don't get teleported without picking up the pickups, so it's fine. Are the pickups necessary, though? I think the level works the same if you just gave 3 builders to start with.

Objects 10. Gravity Lab - Cool. It took a couple of attempts to realize the order I needed to assign the skills and how I had to use the second builder. I like how it demonstrates that small delays can make a big difference. Is there a reason why a fencer is provided, rather than a basher? I think a basher would tempt someone to use it to bypass the splat pad, only to find out they needed to save it for the end.

Objects 11. Stop, Rewind And Go! - Tough puzzle. It does a good job of show casing pause and rewind, but it's pretty challenging for a tutorial, since it involves many different skills and the solution isn't obvious.

Objects 12. Big Steps Through The Snow - The final bridge is annoyingly precise... which is good, since it forces people to use the hotkeys. I'm really surprised at how much easier the hotkeys make building. This level single-highhandedly changed my entire playstyle!

Objects 13. Getting Into Sortings - Cute and clever. I appreciate that it works no matter which way the lemmings are walking when they fall down.

Objects 14. Highlights With A Safety Net - Don't like this one. It's odd that this is the highlight lemming tutorial, when the puzzle is instead about realizing that you can shortcut long falls using miners, and that you can build spiral staircases. Consequently, it feels out of place. More like a basic training level than a skill/object tutorial. I think spamming floaters would be fine to create a sense of 'doing two things at once', even if it makes the puzzle less interesting.

Objects 15. Night Of The Living Lems - Great. Love the theming and the fact the puzzle makes you use a few different methods of dealing with the zombies. The cloner pickup feels unnecessary since you don't really duplicate a skill with it. Maybe provide another climber instead?

Objects 16. Neutral Response - Great. I really like that this demonstrates creative ways to get ahead of the pack.

---

Basic Training 1. Tower of Training - I like that the level goes from bottom to top, rather than top to bottom. I also like that it's mostly safe for lems and has an abundance of skills, allowing for peaceful experimentation. Perfect for a first level of basic training. Floaters, diggers and miners all feel pretty useless, though. While I understand that figuring out which skills are more useful is part of the tutorial, I think some small design tweaks facilitate routes that actually use these skills. Also, I don't like the graves at the bottom of the level. It's easy for lems to get stuck between them and freeing them is more annoying than interesting.

Basic Training 2. With Minimal Efforts - Great. I enjoyed the realization that I could escape the starting area by chaining two digging skills.

Basic Training 3. Blocker Rocker - Excellent. Incredible how it demonstrates the need for pioneers and several different ways of removing blockers all in one puzzle. Using a digger in that way was new to me. One of my favourite tutorials in the pack.

Basic Training 4. Steely Halls - Great. Big fan of how this puzzle makes use of concepts from the previous puzzle. I particularly like the ending section.

Basic Training 5. Scrap The Buttons! - Tough. This stumped me for several attempts. I suspect my solution is not the intended solution. I really struggled with finding a way to prepare the path and hit both buttons without a lemming dying or getting stuck. Should probably be after Limited Release, if not later. Realizing I could get the glider to fly again by boosting it up with a builder was a really cool discovery, though.

Basic Training 6. Limited Release - Good. I like the small twist you put on freeing the blocker here. I like how you're still building on concepts introduced in previous levels.

Basic Training 7. Backup Wall - Decent. I like the visual design. Using three builders to make a wall is really precise. Took several attempts to make it work, even with frame advance. I think the ground in the starting area should be flat, because the bumps make it hard to make the wall.

Basic Training 8. The Builder Drain - Great. Seems like a good builder practice level.

Basic Training 9. Top-Down Approach - Excellent. I had no idea bashers and steel slopes worked that way. A clear demonstration of these interactions. One of my favorite levels in the pack.

Basic Training 10. Reacharound - Clever. This one stumped me because I insisted on sending my climber left first. Once I finally figured out that was wrong, it all came together. Really like how this builds on the previous puzzle.

Basic Training 11. Central Fear - Great. The fact lemmings can alternate which way they come out of the window was an unexpected surprise! The level looks intimidating, but turned out to a lot easier than it looked. I actually think this could go earlier in the level list. Directly after Steely Halls, maybe?

Basic Training 12. It's A Stretch - Good. This level is a strange mix, but each half works. I think the bottom could be improved so it isn't just three of the same action, though.

Basic Training 13. Delaying the Inevitable - Great. I feel like the temple aesthetic really suits the level layout and concept.

Basic Training 14. Chalk Walk - Also great. I'm actually surprised by how lenient you were - I placed most of my blockers pixel perfectly and ended up with a huge amount of spare time. Maybe you should shorten the pack's path a little?

Basic Training 15. The Joy of Sorting - Not a fan. While it was a fun concept like the first time, I think this is too similar to Getting Into Sortings. The first half of the puzzle is almost exactly the same. Also, as a tutorial, I'm not sure what purpose this level serves.

Basic Training 16-30 to come tomorrow~

Attached are my replays so far and the alternate (unintended?) solution to Block & Blow

[namida]

From the perspective of a brand new lemmings player, I think the release rates are a little high across the board in Skills and Objects.

If you're comparing to the release rates in the DOS / Amiga / etc games, do keep in mind that NeoLemmix release rates aren't equivalent to the same number RR in DOS. A DOS release rate of 1 would be RR 50 in NeoLemmix (with NL's RR 1 being much slower than any valid value in DOS).

The reasoning behind this is that, in DOS, every two consecutive values are identical in terms of their in-game effects. For example, there's no difference between 98 and 99. NeoLemmix "un-duplicates" these values, then uses the extra space created (values below 50) for new, even-slower RRs.

[DireKrow]

From the perspective of a brand new lemmings player, I think the release rates are a little high across the board in Skills and Objects.

If you're comparing to the release rates in the DOS / Amiga / etc games, do keep in mind that NeoLemmix release rates aren't equivalent to the same number RR in DOS. A DOS release rate of 1 would be RR 50 in NeoLemmix (with NL's RR 1 being much slower than any valid value in DOS).

The reasoning behind this is that, in DOS, every two consecutive values are identical in terms of their in-game effects. For example, there's no difference between 98 and 99. NeoLemmix "un-duplicates" these values, then uses the extra space created (values below 50) for new, even-slower RRs.

Nah, I played the NL conversion of them. I'm unfamiliar with the actual original release rate. I just based the comment on how I felt.

To elaborate: In a lot of the Skills levels there is no actual danger, so release rate wouldn't impact the solution. But a low release rate means it's easier to see how mechanics work in isolation. You can see how a miner's animation digs out its tunnel without a bunch of lemmings getting in the way of it. You can see the dig/bash/mine/build zones of lemmings when you hover them without it flickering as other lemmings walk past. You can easily pick the lemmings you want to assign skills to without accidental misclicks. Things like that. My philosophy would be to err on the conservative side of release rates in early aimed-at-new-players tutorial puzzles. Reduces stress, increases clarity.

I remember while doing the Fencer/Miner level the first time, I stopped and had a look at where I needed to go next for a few seconds, and by the time I'd gotten back to my lemmings, the hole they were in was filled up. New player would have a bear of a time trying to mine correctly in the situation.

[Proxima]

Playing through the latest version of the pack. My feedback on the first three ranks as they are now:

Rank 1 - Skills

1-1 Intro text is scrunched vertically. Include blank lines after "Welcome to NeoLemmix!" and in between paragraphs. (This recurs on several levels, so I won't point it out every time.)

1-3 Prefer "wider tunnel" to "bigger". When the lemmings have to mine left from above the arrow terrain, it is tricky to select one going the right way without directional select, which hasn't been introduced yet. Maybe add steel on the level edge so that mining the wrong way doesn't fail the level.

1-4 I agree with DireKrow about the awkwardness of mentioning the exact fall height.

1-5 Add 5 more bombers for getting rid of leftover blockers, since the player doesn't know about nuke yet. (It's possible to solve with 6 bombers and 3 blockers, so the player would have enough bombers left anyway, but a beginner player may not solve the level optimally.)

1-8 Hyphenate "mid-air". This is a very long text; maybe cut "Until then Lemmings can still walk over it though" as this is redundant with the previous sentence.

1-11 Hyphenate "bottom-left". Replace "spawns in" with "releases"; we should respect the fiction that lemmings are cute animals we are trying to save, not just game objects. (I am averse to "hatch" as well, but this may just be because both "hatch" and "spawn" are Lix terminology.)

1-12 "Countdown" is one word.

Rank 2 - Objects & Functions

2-1 "You" is missing in "so you can look around". Maybe replace "enter pause mode" with "pause the game" to make room for it.

This level is so large and has so much decoration that fast-forward does absolutely nothing! Namida would be better able to tell you about what exactly is the cause, but this is a big problem for a level that intends to teach fast-forwarding.

2-2 Replace the full stop with a comma after "Levels can vary in height".

Intro text says "None" for clear physics mode even though I have it assigned to "C". One to take up with namida....

Maybe require only 25/30, since the middle group on the left edge can't be salvaged if the basher goes too far, and the player hasn't been introduced to timeskipping for error correction yet. (Or move this level later.)

2-3 Fun level! Easy enough that it could take the 2-2 slot if we decide to move that level up.

2-4 Any particular reason why tracks orig_16 and 17 are skipped? Not complaining, just curious

2-6 "Can already have", not "already can have".

2-8 Prefer "cannot" to "can't".

2-10 Really nice level!

2-11 Prefer "yet" to "still".

2-12 Comma after "ten seconds". I see why this level mentions the possibility of changing your layout -- it certainly makes me wish I had a "back 5 seconds" or "back 10 seconds" hotkey for when I misjudge the long bridges!

2-13 Prefer "release" to "spawn", again. I remember this level, and I'm glad you simplified it -- the new version is much less confusing but still a great puzzle!

2-14 Comma after "skipping back", and move "are" to the next line. "Keep track of", not "on". Don't hyphenate "screen area".

2-16 "Safe path", not "save path". "Straight to", not "straight into". "Could theoretically", not "theoretically could" -- although I would prefer to re-word this entirely. It's not theoretical, it is actually an important part of gameplay! Something like "they may already have a path to the exit" or "they may nonetheless be able to reach the exit". Great puzzle -- took me a while to find the solution!

Rank 3 - Basic Training

3-1"Practice", not "routine". Because tracks 16 and 17 are skipped in your music rotation, this ends up with the annoying "Doggie" track. Yay.

3-2 Fun level.

3-3 Very nice showcase of blocker removal; no complaints.

3-5 The way the terrain is shaped makes removing the crowd control blocker rather fiddly. Maybe provide a couple of miners?

3-6 Feels redundant. Sure, it shows blocker removal with a digger, but we've already seen that, and that makes four blocker removal levels in a row. The beginner player would probably be itching to see some new tricks now!

3-7 Typo: "substitue". Prefer "three" to "3". Nice that this level has "O Little Town" for the music.

Lower the release rate, so the first builder has already placed some bricks so the player can judge whether the second builder is right next to them! I can do this comfortably, but I don't think a beginner could. The builder to the first of the three islands has to be placed precisely to avoid a diagonal gap into which lemmings would fall, even though this mechanic hasn't been introduced.

3-8 This could be solved with a three-builder wall, but I have other methods

3-9 Remove "instead", which seems to be a leftover from a previous formulation of this sentence.

3-10 An intro text is needed to explain multiple pick-up skills, and that gliders bounce off walls. Very nice puzzle!

3-11 Nice introduction to the double walker for releasing a blocker. This one doesn't need an intro text; it makes its point very well.

3-12 Comma after "falls off the bridge". Prefer "get past" to "get around". Should the intro text let the player know which object is the exit? The third gap doesn't actually need any stretching.

3-13 Prefer "path" to "way" and "these" to "those".

3-15 Oh, so this is where the level ended up

3-16 Comma after "noticed". Typo: "scrificed". Could we not use the Millas? The player won't know what's going on and will probably expect these to be some variety of lemming with special properties that hasn't been introduced yet.

Did I break this level, or were you meant to hold the crowd under the trapdoor? I had several leftover skills and saved one extra, which is okay for a tutorial puzzle, of course. The intro text suggests that you are not meant to do this but instead should let the crowd flow through the level and choose the correct skill to turn them round, which I tried first and got pretty frustrated until I saw that there was a simple way to finish the level. Overall, I'm not a fan of this one.

3-17 Nice simple introduction to the digger pit. Maybe it should be explicitly mentioned that, depending on the terrain and release rate, the second lemming may or may not slip past the digger.

3-18 Towards the end I had to cancel a platformer with a basher, which hasn't been introduced yet. Other than that, nice level.

3-19 Great introduction to its concepts, although deadly edges and building for the sole purpose of turning around on a ceiling should have been introduced before this.

3-20 Typo: "rainsing". "An much needed" should be "a much-needed".

Building to the upper staircase from the nearest step leaves another lemming with the builder, who then dies, but you need 100%. This can be circumvented by building from a higher step, but it seems a bit unfair to require a new player to work that out. Also, what on earth is the walker pick-up skill for?

3-21 "Just abuse that" should be "Just abuse the fact that". Pretty good intro level for this trick, even though it's one I always find annoying when it shows up

3-22 "In front" is two words. Commas before and after "for example". Diggers will only be turned around by a blocker in front of them. Maybe these two tricks should be separated into two levels?

3-23 I'm not wild about the precise timing needed to merge the crowd and the basher, but hey, I guess this is what you were teaching, and some tricks just are inherently annoying.

3-24 Wow this is hard! Firstly it's hard to spot the correct allocation of skills to make the route work at all; then you have to spot the correct place to block and compress the crowd. At first I was trying to compress them at the foot of the large wall, and I think beginner players might also have a frustrating time trying to make that idea work before giving up and looking for something else.

3-25 "Lets" should be "let's". Prefer "one" to "1". The last sentence is awkwardly phrased; I would prefer something like "Also, it is possible to assign bomber or stoner to a climber in mid-climb."

Very nice level. The hardest part was realising I needed to use the stacker-cloner at the very start; everything fell into place after that.

3-26 "In the right height" should be "at". Hyphenate "well-placed". Typo: "natutral".

Another nice level; a bit easier than the last two as there were enough cues to work out the skill allocation pretty easily. The only tough part was that the builder has to have his 11th brick touching the wall, since if he only touches it with his 12th, you can't mine in a way that the other lemmings can walk back up.

3-27 Neat. I've seen levels like this before (and made one, in the Lix community pack) but using a fencer rather than a miner improves things greatly, as you can use the skill shadow to judge exactly where to place the builders.

3-28 Discussed on discord. I had no problem here, but it needs an intro text stating that cloned builders/miners have a skill shadow.

3-29 "More interesting" should be "most interesting". Hyphenate "mid-stroke". Excellent introduction to this concept.

[Proxima]

Intro text says "None" for clear physics mode even though I have it assigned to "C". One to take up with namida....

After some just-digging, I realised why this is. Your intro text includes "[HOTKEY:Clear_Physics:1]", where the "1" means that your clear physics hotkey is set to hold-down rather than toggle. Since the user could have separate hotkeys for clear physics hold-down and toggle, I guess it makes sense that this functionality exists, but I would suggest that "[HOTKEY:Clear_Physics]" should show any clear physics mode hotkey the user has.

I suspect DireKrow's issue with the "next shrugger" hotkey has a similar cause, though it's harder for me to investigate that one as I don't have any hotkey assigned to that.

[IchoTolot]

Thanks for the feedback!

Especially feedback from new players is quite valuable here.

My Comments:

- From the perspective of a brand new lemmings player, I think the release rates are a little high across the board in Skills and Objects. See my second post in the thread for some elaboration.

That or the overall lemming count can be adjusted a little. Although getting the player used to higher RRs is a thing that should be done early.

- In pretexts, referencing the pixel counts feels. weird. I don't think it's more helpful than just saying that lemmings die if they fall too far, for example. Perhaps mention the 64 pixels thing when the ruler is introduced?

1-4 I agree with DireKrow about the awkwardness of mentioning the exact fall height. This is the first level where the player needs to understand they can scroll to see more of the level; should this be mentioned?

It may be not more helpful for everyone, but I do think mention the exact mechanic even this early on is only fair and it doesn't do harm in my opinion.

- There's some issues where for me, in the description, the hotkey says <None> even though I have a hotkey assigned. For example, go-to-next-shrugger is 8 by default, but the description prior to Big Steps Through The Snow just says <None>. Just thought I'd mention it. Also, highlight lemming is not right-click by default (as stated by the Highlights With A Safety Net pretext), it's actually Ctrl+Click.

The <None> cases are probably something for namida to check. The standard layouts should at least assign the keys introduced here.

My mistake will be fixed.

Skills 2. Let's Take A Bash At It! - Also great. I really like the fact you included a staircase to show that not all bashing targets are flat vertical walls. However, I'm not sure what the pillar above the staircase shows that the three pillars in the middle don't already.

The answer is simple: Repetition. It's one of the best way to let lessons sink in. Rpeat until something burns into the players mind.

Skills 5. Block and Blow In The Snow - Good. I particularly like the the miniature puzzle at the end. A new player must figure out how to go down and turn around at the same time. For example, they might be tempted to put a blocker at the ice tip, only to realize it becomes useless when they the bomb the ice. Good learning opportunity. It's possible to complete this level without using any blockers, which might be unintended. See attachment.

That is unintended, yes. I think I will do a little fix even if this is probably not the way people solve it the first time.

Skills 7. Building Flat and Building High - Cool, but too hard? I'd DEFINITELY let a new player get a feel for 1 bridge or 1 platformer at a time in a safe, convenient environment before asking them to chain multiple bridges together, build over water, or build through weirdly shaped terrain. It's important to master these skills ASAP, so maybe the trial by fire is warranted, but this stage definitely feels way tougher than anything else in the tier.

I can put it a few places later, but I especially don't want a completely safe environment here. I think it's an extremely important lesson that losing lemmings is ok when the save requirement allows it and players should learn it as early as possible.

Skills 9. Amphibious Engineer Squad - Good. I like how it demonstrates that water can break long falls and that one disarmer can disarm multiple traps. What happens if a swimmer meets a wall, though?

It turns, I could implement that lesson.

Skills 10. Walking On The Cloner Cliffs - Don't like this one. The fact you can just walk the lemming to the exit and then spam clone in front of it feels really cheap. Doesn't really demonstrate what walkers or cloners can do.

I willl make a slight modification that you can't just clone next to the exit. But I won't show more of the skills just yet. Cloners and walkers, if used to their fully extent are a can of worms better to open a tiny bit later step by step in multiple levels focussing on one or a few more aspects. Trust me there.

Objects 2. Iron Anthill - A little overwhelming. I think the same concepts could have been taught with a smaller level. Looks fun to optimize, though.

That's totally intended. Every section is completely safe and therefore there is no rush. But players need to experience and handle larger vertical levels. So you should take your time at the start and form a plan for one section after the other.

Objects 7. Pick Them Up and Push Them Down - Very nice looking level. A nice introduction to its concepts, as well. Is there supposed to be a one pixel seam between the terrain and steel?

Well, that's a fix.

Objects 9. Beam Them Over - Great. Fantastic presentation. At first, I wasn't sure about the claustrophobic digging, but I suspect you're using it to bunch the lemmings up so they don't get teleported without picking up the pickups, so it's fine. Are the pickups necessary, though? I think the level works the same if you just gave 3 builders to start with.

They are indeed not nessesary. They should just represent some breadcrumps you need to pick up on the way.

Objects 10. Gravity Lab - Cool. It took a couple of attempts to realize the order I needed to assign the skills and how I had to use the second builder. I like how it demonstrates that small delays can make a big difference. Is there a reason why a fencer is provided, rather than a basher? I think a basher would tempt someone to use it to bypass the splat pad, only to find out they needed to save it for the end.

The fencer is just for skill variety, nothing more.

Objects 11. Stop, Rewind And Go! - Tough puzzle. It does a good job of show casing pause and rewind, but it's pretty challenging for a tutorial, since it involves many different skills and the solution isn't obvious.

That's the problem of the topic: Anything requiring rewind is not tutorial easy and just having builders be assigned to everything is not that exciting at all.
That's also a point, even if this is only the object rank I do intend getting slowly more difficult. The levels should require some thinking in my opinion even if they are just a tutorial.

How long did it take you to solve the level if I may ask? That would be a good indicator for me to see if that was still in acceptable territory or indeed too hard.

Objects 12. Big Steps Through The Snow - The final bridge is annoyingly precise... which is good, since it forces people to use the hotkeys. I'm really surprised at how much easier the hotkeys make building. This level single-highhandedly changed my entire playstyle!

Yes, that's the reason for it. You really want to use those hotkeys. I always have my fingers on pause and fast forward for example.

Objects 14. Highlights With A Safety Net - Don't like this one. It's odd that this is the highlight lemming tutorial, when the puzzle is instead about realizing that you can shortcut long falls using miners, and that you can build spiral staircases. Consequently, it feels out of place. More like a basic training level than a skill/object tutorial. I think spamming floaters would be fine to create a sense of 'doing two things at once', even if it makes the puzzle less interesting.

That's a surprise for me. I guess this is a case where things appear so trivial that you don't even realise that they need explaining. Spamming floaters is a bit boring though. Would a few diggers on top of the miners help you here as well?

The cloner pickup feels unnecessary since you don't really duplicate a skill with it

Let's just say that this sentence is not correct.    It is very often the case in lemmings that you just clone for the extra lemming or the direction change.

Basic Training 1. Tower of Training - I like that the level goes from bottom to top, rather than top to bottom. I also like that it's mostly safe for lems and has an abundance of skills, allowing for peaceful experimentation. Perfect for a first level of basic training. Floaters, diggers and miners all feel pretty useless, though. While I understand that figuring out which skills are more useful is part of the tutorial, I think some small design tweaks facilitate routes that actually use these skills. Also, I don't like the graves at the bottom of the level. It's easy for lems to get stuck between them and freeing them is more annoying than interesting.

Get stuck, free yourself. That is the reason the graves are there. There are so many cases in levels where your rodents get stuck exactly like this, I just want to prepare you again here, even if that means being a little annoying.

Basic Training 5. Scrap The Buttons! - Tough. This stumped me for several attempts. I suspect my solution is not the intended solution. I really struggled with finding a way to prepare the path and hit both buttons without a lemming dying or getting stuck. Should probably be after Limited Release, if not later. Realizing I could get the glider to fly again by boosting it up with a builder was a really cool discovery, though.

I agree, will move this.

Basic Training 7. Backup Wall - Decent. I like the visual design. Using three builders to make a wall is really precise. Took several attempts to make it work, even with frame advance. I think the ground in the starting area should be flat, because the bumps make it hard to make the wall.

I will flatten a hill then.

Basic Training 11. Central Fear - Great. The fact lemmings can alternate which way they come out of the window was an unexpected surprise! The level looks intimidating, but turned out to a lot easier than it looked. I actually think this could go earlier in the level list. Directly after Steely Halls, maybe?

I think you pointed me at a good swapping candidate for the button level here.

Basic Training 14. Chalk Walk - Also great. I'm actually surprised by how lenient you were - I placed most of my blockers pixel perfectly and ended up with a huge amount of spare time. Maybe you should shorten the pack's path a little?

Well, I do intended that no blockers needs to be perfect. That can add up quite a bit. You will encounter enough precision during later levels.

Basic Training 15. The Joy of Sorting - Not a fan. While it was a fun concept like the first time, I think this is too similar to Getting Into Sortings. The first half of the puzzle is almost exactly the same. Also, as a tutorial, I'm not sure what purpose this level serves.

Purpose: Repetiton, training. No new lesson here.

I remember while doing the Fencer/Miner level the first time, I stopped and had a look at where I needed to go next for a few seconds, and by the time I'd gotten back to my lemmings, the hole they were in was filled up. New player would have a bear of a time trying to mine correctly in the situation.

Reading this, maybe instead of lowring the release rate, I should introduce the pause button earlier on. I think that's a good idea. Normally when you look at/think about/freshly enter a level you should hit pause. If you are not looking diectly at your lemmings the pause button should be on. Pause THE essential button of the game. It should come as early as level 1 or 2. 

2-4 Any particular reason why tracks orig_16 and 17 are skipped? Not complaining, just curious

I habe no idea why, didn't even know that they were skipped.


Also thanks to Proxima for the grammar related suff.

Note to myself: Mention skill shadows a bit more.


I will either implement these changes with introduction of the 4th rank or a bit earlier.

[Proxima]

I have no idea why, didn't even know that they were skipped.

The culprit is the music.nxmi file, which is missing the lines TRACK orig_16 and TRACK orig_17. You can add these back if it's not deliberate. Though 16 is one of the more annoying tracks, so I won't complain if you leave this unfixed!

[DireKrow]

Second half of Basic Training:

Spoiler

Basic Training 16 - Hidden Crystalline Temple - Rather tough. I ended up skipping the puzzle and coming back to it later. The main herdles were: (A) realizing that the two lems that slip past a stacker can be used as a pioneer and a stoner sacrifice, and (B) that you should put the lemmings in a holding pattern that you can break out of it using the builders later in the puzzle. I think the pretext needs to be rephrased, because it's misleading. After I read it, I assumed the puzzle would include lemmings dying and instead would be about trying to get your stackers ahead of the crowd so they would have time to put up their walls. Consequently, it took me a while to realize that I had to contain the crowd rather than letting them roam free. I think the pre-text should maybe focus more on how you can use slow construction skills to purposefully create pioneers.

Basic Training 17 - Dig The Trench! - Solid. Not much else to say.

Basic Training 18 - Sandy Danger - Excellent! I like how it's open-ended, but all of the solutions reveal something new and subtle. One of my favourites in the pack.

Basic Training 19 - Steps and Pixels - Great. I was really wondering about this, so I'm glad this level was included. The choice of theme was smart for this.

Basic Training 20 - Stepblocked - Great. I like that it builds on the previous puzzle. Typo in the pretext: "rainsing" should be "raising".

Basic Training 21 - The Steepest Slope - Decent. I'd prefer a different tileset for this, because the dark patches on the crystals make it hard to see how deep/far you've dug. I had to redo my tunnel a couple of times because of that. It works as a puzzle, but I really hope this technique isn't that commonly used, because it's pretty tedious.

Basic Training 22 - A Sudden Change In Direction - Great. I appreciate that the route is so clearly indicated in this one.

Basic Training 23 - Concentrated Force - Good. Nice escalation of a previous idea.

Basic Training 24 - Blocked In Your Favor - Tough. Took me a while to figure out how to get the two pickups. Then it took me a while to realize there was a ledge on the right-hand side of the level that I could use to stack my lemmings up. Can you make that ledge more obvious, perhaps? Now that I know the solution, I think this is a great puzzle. I really like how it incorporates multiple concepts from previous levels.

Basic Training 25 - Double Down! - Great. It was a lot to take in, but the solution was so satisfying to watch! I found a way to save a cloner, as we discussed on the discord (just mine left without cloning at the end), but my replay uses the 'intended' solution anyway.

Basic Training 26 - Combine & Conquer - Also great. Never thought to use construction skills this way before, so thanks for introducing it.

Basic Training 27 - Fancy Fencer - Excellent. The fact you used the bookcase theme was really smart, because you can use it as a grid along with the items on the shelves to line up your diggers and builders with the fencing shadow. One of my favourites in the pack.

Basic Training 28 - Equal Distributon - We talked about this one on discord. It's pretty brutal, but also ingenious and one of my favourite puzzle concepts in the pack. A pretext should probably mention that cloners should sometimes be delayed and/or you might have the right idea on how to solve a puzzle, but you need to change your positioning.

Basic Training 29 - Special Staircase - Great. Had no idea you could interrupt digging skills mid-animation to do those sorts of things.

Basic Training 30 - Stepping Up To The Stars - Great test of the skills you were taught in the previous puzzle. Lots of great tiny lessons.

Attached are the replays of my first successful solutions

[IchoTolot]

I will include fixes based on your feedback when I finished rank 4.

Sorry for being slow here, but right now exams and other stuff are also requiring some attention and the last 2 months or so I've been lacking a bit in the ideas+inspiration departement as well.

[IchoTolot]

V 0.15 is out!

Rank 3 got split up into 2 ranks: The first 14 level were punt into the new rank 3 and the other 16 were put into the new rank 5.

New levels:

- 2 03 (introduction of deadly level sides)

- 3 03 (Builders hitting heads)
- 3 08 (Spiral staircases)
- 3 09 (Training: Blockers and spiral staircases)
- 3 15 (Shimmier + walker)
- 3 16 (Training: Shimmier + walker + glider)

- 4 05 (Teleporter does not reset distance fallen)
- 4 06 (Builder + platformer turn trick)
- 4 07 (Training: Teleporter does not reset distance fallen, Builder + platformer turn trick)

- Rank 5 "Advanced Training" has been added with 19 new levels.

Changes:

- A bunch of spelling errors.

- Music rotation includes orig 16+17 now.

- 1 01 (Text mentiones Pause right away now)
- 1 03 (Reduced RR and lem count)
- 1 05 (Backroute fix, +5 bombers)
- 1 07 (Text mentions that lemming losses are acceptable)
- 1 09 (Demonstrates now that swimmers turn if they swim into a wall)
- 1 10 (Changed exit area so that lems can walk out to the right now)

- 2 01 (reduced decoration)
- 2 03 <--> 2 04
- 2 08 (fixed visual error)
- 2 09 (Text mentiones now that splitters cannot be deactivated)
- 2 15 (Does not require a spiral staircase anymore, -8 builders)

- 3 06 <--> 3 14
- 3 10 (Reduced RR, flattened starting area)
- 3 13 (Test now mentiones multiple pick-up skils and that gliders bounce off walls)
- 3 14 (Made blocker spot clearer now and added steel)
- 3 17 (Widened 3rd gap by 1 pixel)

- 4 02 (Text now mentiones that the crowd should be contained)
- 4 03 (Text now mentiones that the digger holding pit can be affected by RR and terrain)
- 4 13 (New helper pre text)
- 4 14 (Backroute fix)
- 4 17 (Text now provides more hints)