Lemmings Speedrunning

[Nihilist Comedy Hour]

Someone submitted runs for Easy on SMS and NES. Not at all optimized, but impressive anyone even got through it given the platform.

Sorry, I've recently moved, so I was AWOL there for a bit. I'm not sure it's actually possible to do a 100% speedrun of the game. I realize glitches allow some of the non-100% levels to happen, but is it actually possible to 100% all 120 levels?

[Proxima]

It is not. You can check the highest % saved in this topic in Challenges. On DOS Lemmings, 101 levels can be 100% saved without glitches, two more with glitches. Other versions may have slight differences (and in some cases, include some completely different levels, as you know) but none of the main versions of Lemmings 1 allows for 100% on every level.

Thus, when we talk about max% we're talking about saving the highest % possible (and in most cases we're pretty confident our records are indeed the best that can be achieved).

[Nihilist Comedy Hour]

That'd be one hell of a verification process.

[Nihilist Comedy Hour]

Hmm. Someone beat the Fun Levels on the NES in 18:38. Only 25 Levels on the NES, and the frame rate runs clearly much higher, with slightly smaller levels. Not perfectly optimized or anything, but impressive.

[Proxima]

That would be forum member Nessy, by the way.

[Nihilist Comedy Hour]

That would be forum member Nessy, by the way.

Oh, nice. Truly badass stuff. Given the different level sizes, the rate at which the game runs and the reduced levels, 1:30 run on all the levels seems totally plausible, whereas I imagine anything under 5 hrs for the DOS version to be vaguely possible.

[Nessy]

Hi! Sorry for the speedrun seemly coming out of nowhere like that without prior announcement. I did want to try my hand at speedrunning a Lemmings game even if for a little while but wasn't sure what port was the most ideal for me. When news of that first NES speedrun was published here I suddenly remembered the game and thought it was the most ideal speedrun for me for its shorter length and familiarity. I did play the port a lot as a child and was familiar with some of its weirder mechanics that can be taken advantage of (like assigning a basher just when a builder is about to finish because it won't take effect immediately but instead when the builder is either halfway done or completely done). Other good things to take advantage of is learning some better timing for hitting that nuke button earlier on some levels for optimization purposes. It's a bit uncharted territory, and a little exciting!

I definitely want to try my hand at the other ranks as well when I get a chance and maybe do a full "All Levels" run to see if 1:30 is indeed possible

[607]

I definitely want to try my hand at the other ranks as well when I get a chance and maybe do a full "All Levels" run to see if 1:30 is indeed possible

Awesome!

[The Tomato Watcher]

Hey. It's me, the guy who sent in that Fun 12 speedrun of LAUGHABLE quality to speedrun.com . I'm just here to ask, "What was your initial reaction to that run?"

I wanna do more individual level speedruns like that, but, y'know, better in every way.

[Nihilist Comedy Hour]

Hey. It's me, the guy who sent in that Fun 12 speedrun of LAUGHABLE quality to speedrun.com . I'm just here to ask, "What was your initial reaction to that run?"

I wanna do more individual level speedruns like that, but, y'know, better in every way.

Ah, nothing too crazy. Some people submit their first runs to games I moderate, so it wasn't too shocking. People like to track their progression as well, so it makes it easier. Please feel free to submit more individual level runs. Gives me motivation to come back to get a better time.

[ccexplore]

Just want to mention that the Lemmings Arcade prototype might be even more ideal for a speedrun than NES.  While I don't think the lemmings in arcade prototype move quite as fast as on NES, the arcade prototype has only 67 levels and even more importantly, you only have to save a single lemming in any level to move onto the next.  And sometimes the levels are shortened as well (compared to original versions on Amiga/DOS) via repositioning of exits or entrances.  And yes, there are some unique and exploitable glitches that might be helpful here and there.

[Nihilist Comedy Hour]

Just want to mention that the Lemmings Arcade prototype might be even more ideal for a speedrun than NES.  While I don't think the lemmings in arcade prototype move quite as fast as on NES, the arcade prototype has only 67 levels and even more importantly, you only have to save a single lemming in any level to move onto the next.  And sometimes the levels are shortened as well (compared to original versions on Amiga/DOS) via repositioning of exits or entrances.  And yes, there are some unique and exploitable glitches that might be helpful here and there.

I'll have to check it out. I didn't even realize the prototype was complete enough to run.



On a side note, another SMS/Fun run was submitted today, cutting over 50% of the time off the previous run.

[Nihilist Comedy Hour]

Hey y'all. Been a while, but since the NES port has started to get a little traction. Just thought I'd give a little update on the few levels.

Nessy set a time on the Fun Levels a year ago at 18:38. It stood for a while, but a fellow that speedruns NES games (NESCardinality)  gave it a shot a couple weeks ago, and was able to shave a minute off the run to make the record 17:38. This morning, I verified another run by a player called crasyfingers. He shaved 26 seconds off the previous run, and now holds the record at 17:12. Looking at the run, it's pretty well optimized. Maybe a second or two could be saved on pulling things off a little differently. There's a couple levels where I can see minute differences of a few seconds with slightly different strategies, but unless some new strat is found on one of the levels, I can't see a sub-17 happening. I'd be interested if anyone can see a strategy that isn't currently utilized that might make a sub 17 possible.

There is no NES TAS in the TAS archives I can see to look at.

[Simon]

NuclearHyrule posted two threads on SMS Lemmings Fun RTA to /r/speedrun:

Reddit thread on We All Fall Down -- Youtube video
Exploits spawn interval of 2 that's apparently possible on SMS with RR 98. Most ports' quickest spawn interval is 4.

Reddit thread on If Only They Could Fly -- Youtube video
Builds bridge in the only possible location that both avoids head bump at decoration and reaches the target platform high enough to ascend.

Looks like everybody is busy on a different port.

-- Simon

[petaQ]

Hi Simon, yeah that's me, I had planned to come back to Lemmings SMS this winter and I found a large number of perfections to my old solutions which I've now nearly finished. The full playlist can be seen at https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLOTsjhPmEfJd9ccq6yzH6VL9ObH9M9hYr and the fastest possible 30-level run is now down at just under 31 1/2 minutes. The improvements generally fall under either pixel-perfect actions (bridges, bashes, even floats), tighter tail management, or better management of lag. The definite highlight of this is

-Don't Do Anything Too Hasty. You think you need blockers to solve this level? Think again. What used to be a high-lag run killer nightmare is now a gimme.

What used to be a run of risky levels from 15-23 is now mostly safe. 9 is just a lag nightmare, the only stress now is 17/18 which demand precision. Will be attempting to lower the WR to around the 32.xx mark soon then perfecting Tricky.