The London Bombs

[Andi]

I'm also very shocked because of the bombs but sometimes I wonder myself...

Two years ago a freak killed 12 classmates and a teacher in school (here in Germany, you propapbly heard of it.), recently died about 30-50 people by terrorist attacks, okay on 9/11 it were a lot people who died but...
Do you know, how many people die in car accidents? How many people die in africa? In india? All over the world? How many people die because there are shot down by their own government? They only say "20 people died by terrorist attack on blah blah...". They always complain computer games are making kids violent. But how many people died because of video games? Well, I guess almost no one. I think the problems of this world are not guys like Osama or Saddam or games or whatever. The Problems of this world are things that no one wants to miss! Things like Alcohol, drugs, cars, food (did you know big trades just throw the half of their food away, to keep the price up? And on the other side people die because of too less!) WE are the problem! We want to ride car and accept that in Germany for example die every year as many people in car accidents as live in a small town (You can't tell me terrorists wiped out a whole town!). WE want to sit around with friends and drink beer or Whisky or Vodka or whatever and accept that thousends of people die because of alcohol! As long as we don't do anything to prevent that the government is bribed by big drug dealers there will be no hope for the victims.

Just a few sentences to mention the other side.

[Lemeri]

I say ignore the freaking terrorists. If you get too worked up about them, that's what they're aiming for.

[drumnbach]

It is easy to blame terrorists for our problems because they are such an abstract concept (I'm not denying that 9/11 or the London Bombing ever happened; I'm saying that the notion that terrorists are an organised body, as some believe, is wrong). Governments of the UK and US wage war on this [terror\ and keep reminding us that they\re hard at work doing so, while the real terrorists like the IRA and President Mugabe of Zimbabwe remain at large. This [war on terror\ is nothing more than a deflection from the real issues, and we all lap it up like suckers.

[Timballisto]

Hrg.

It's not like terrorists don't cause any problems.  They are causing unrest in lots of areas like you said.  However, I agree that at the same time they are by no means the source of all problems.  Personally, I think it's important to get rid of terrorists though, because in areas of genocide and such, like Andi said with governments shooting their own people, I think that if all of that would just stop, the stupid area could finally start focusing on its own well being and development.

Only, with the car crashes, is kind of debatable to me.  Yes there are a lot of car crashes and deaths by car accidents, but I wonder who would opt to ride 500 miles by bike rather than by car.  Also, if you were using the bike, how could you move X tons of steel, plastics, cars, piping, infrastructure materials such as wire for electric lines or other things, etc.  Trains are a good alternative for cargo but people seem to be using more airplanes for that now, atleast in the US.  Where exactly did you here about the government getting bribed by drug dealers?  It's a believable claim, but, I don't see anything that supports it really.  One thing that gets me about that is, if we were being bribed...atleast the US anyway...then we would probably be with the movement for legalized marijuana in the US.  We also wouldn't have the anti drug programs in schools and such.

I don't think it's a good thing that large food industries throw out their food.  If they sold it in Africa no one could buy it, BUT they could give it away certainly!  

If they did sell all of it, I'm not sure what would happen.  Bear with me as I try to analyze the impact of this using my limited knowledge.  Hm.  Well, what would happen is they would probably sell the same amount of food, and they would lose money for the food the could've sold at the higher price.  So, all that extra food goes to waste anyway.  Then, the farmers and employees working for the food company get paid less, I think, and their quality of living goes down.  Also the food company can't pay as much to get its grain shipped from the fields to the factories when they need the rail roads to haul grain everywhere, so they might have problems with that.  Not to mention packaging and processing the stuff from the fields so it looks like what's in the stores.  They need to hire people to run all of those things, so that's more money they need to spend, but they made less money because prices were lower so it was harder to pay these people too.

Well, I hope that was atleast 5% correct.  If I got anything out of that, it would be that they might be better off giving it away to Africa.

The only problem is if the food companies go out the farmers are no longer employeed, and they grow food and sell it on their own.  That would be kind of odd.  So certain products would no longer be available that we liked, like cereal and stuff.  Also the rail roads have lost business because the farmers can't afford to ship the crops and would probably rather just ship their harvests to local markets anyway and have no need to ship anything far away.

Bah!  Get a real economics person in here and fix this!  Tell me if anything in this sounds right.

Well if you were looking for something that meant anything this next sentence would be it:  I agree that we cause our own problems by ignoring them.

[Andi]

I'm neither a professional, but what I heard is, that a lot of the bought food is thrown away, because if they would sell it, it had to be a very cheap price because you don't need more food when more is available. But I also ask myself: Why do they make so much food??? Making less food (I know that case especially from fruits, because I once saw a pic of MOUNTAINS of oranges for no other reason than let it become dirt) would save money and the environment.

And because of bribes:
In England once was a test: Doctors where allowed to give drug replacements to people who have problems with herroin for example. This had 2 big advantages: They where away from illegality because didn't need to gain it anymore from dealers annd they where away from "the scene" and where able to be at their family.
But then there was a new government and the test was canceled. No one knows why, they only said "Too less money!"
Everyone said it was a great project with success, so I don't think they would cancel for such a reason. It was in only one town, so it couldn't have been that expensive.
If you ask me, that could be because big dealers said "HEY! We are loosing money!" and gave some big guys some money and they said "Leave it!". If I remember we had something like that here, too. Also cancelled. Very suspicius. But I can't proof it, yeah.

I gave the example for the cars only to show that we won't die out because of terrorists. It only annoys me because no one cares about these "small accidents" (Did you know? In Germany die 800 people per year because of fish bones. O_o How many died in terrorist attacks?) and most people say "ZOMG! 5 died because of Osama!". And cars could be build MUCH stronger, but the companies, don't want it. They would loose money, because you wouldn't have to repair it that often or buy a new one. ANother reason why I would prefer a military vehicle. It looks weird, but you are much safer.


(If we go on like this, I have to open a "Political" Forum  .)

[AstralLemming]

I heard that, if Iraq didn't have oil, America would have probably just left the place to its own devices and to take care of their own tyrant. And thus, Bush most likely only did what he did because it could earn his country resources.

It also seems like this 'war on terror' could easily be the main  cause of the London bombs. It looks like this could easily become a full scale war. I'm seriously hoping this isn't going to turn into World War III... I don't think I'd be able to cope with rationing...

I know I sound kind of pessimistic, but you never can tell...

[Isu]

Yes, this is World war III. Did you not know that? Terrorism poses a threat to the whole world (Egypt has just had a recent incident), It's us, against the lunatics trying to blow everyone up (Germany is on our side this time ). I know that in England, security has stepped up over the past few weeks. Many more people have been arrested due to them being potential terrorists..

Sorry to be going against what everyone else said about "not worrying about terror" but I believe the threat is real and something needs to be done about it.
So what if 800 people die a year from fish bones, that's because of their own stupidity. 5 deaths by Osama is much worse than 800 deaths by plain stupidity.

(A political forum might not be a bad Idea, although I'm a very political person, so I might be a bit biased on this )

[Andi]

...(Germany is on our side this time )...

Now what does THAT pretend to be. XD I'm blowing up my own government before we fight on the side of mad gone religous uber extremists. Hopefully we can kick some Nazis arses by the way.

And yes, WW3 is coming! I guess in the next 3 years. Maybe already in this. The world wide political atmosphere is just too streesed. I really wonder what will happen, when China starts to attack the "disloyal province" America HAS to do something. But now comes tho most interesting part: China has threaten the US to use nuclear weapons if they attack China...
On the other side old politicals talk about bombing Mekka to stop terrorism...

WW3 seems to be much more cruel than WW2 or WW1. Jews, Islams, who's the next? Christs? Hindus?


Thsi reminds me to an album from NoFX. The war on errorism. I think this fits much better.

[AstralLemming]

WW3 seems to be much more cruel than WW2 or WW1. Jews, Islams, who's the next? Christs? Hindus?

This kind of thing makes me glad I'm not religious.

[Andi]

Join the club.

[tumble_weed]

Thsi reminds me to an album from NoFX. The war on errorism. I think this fits much better.

hehe more like Bad Religion ...they had a song called World War III

um anyway I'm up for a political/ethics/debate/whatever... type forum

oh and about 800 people dying of fish bones vs 5 people dying as a result of Osama. (im not sure exactly what incident you're talking about...but still) The thing that counts is not so much how many people die, but more about the circumstances. Terrorism is designed specifically to cause chaos and fear, however 800 people dying of fishbones doesn't cause much widespread fear and chaos (at least I hope not). Also there are usually a large amount of casualties involved in terroism as opposed to usually minimal casualties involved with fish eating.

but the problem with me and really long posts is that by the time i finish reading everything I can't remember all the things I wanted to write...but I'd be up for a new forum

[Isu]

Now what does THAT pretend to be.

It's okay, I wasn't having a dig at you personally. I was just trying to compare how Germany was involved in the first two world wars to how it will be involved in this one.

[JM]

I don't know how Germany was involved in the first two world wars. Is this seriously World War 3?

[Conway]

It seems that way.

[the guest]

Depends on how you "define" war I guess.

I'm not really sure I'd call the current situation with the radical Islamic terrorists as a "war".

More worrisome to me are nations like North Korea and Iran because of their nuclear development.