Lemmings Forums Level Contest #11 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)

[Crane]

Well, I'm working on V16 to help with that issue, so you can't go through the floor.  Not sure how to deal with Minim's backroute though - pondering.

[Simon]

Well, I'm working on V16 to help with that issue, so you can't go through the floor.

Awesome. Maybe RR = 99 too, because missing RR 1 -> 99 loses several seconds. Depends on how precise the time limit is, and how much scope for errors is left in the intended route.

Here's another backroute for v15. I believe this comes from the digger removal, but I haven't tried in v13. Needs the stable physics agin, not exp.

-- Simon

[bulletride]

One easy to fix back route and one possibly intended solution.

Spoiler

I would move the exit to the left a little bit to make it slightly more visible that you can build to turn around there now.

[Crane]

Second replay is more or less intended - well done.  As for Minim's backroute... I don't know where to begin.  Fixing it may require a fundamental redesign of the level, although I'll try working on something on the side.

[Minim]

At the moment I'm comparing my backroute with Bulletride's possibly intended solution, and also thinking of ideas to prevent mine and Simon's backroutes. Spoilering it just in case:

Spoiler

It turns out that my builder placement on the grassy patch on the bottom right side of the left island is a bit further to the right than that of the intended solution, so you could try erasing a bit of that terrain to block that backroute. As for Simon's backroute - I suggest either adding one-way left arrows in the first wall, or adding a rock trap

[Crane]

Well, see how version 16 currently compares.  The trouble is, you can jiggle the timings a lot so the Climber always lands on the top step in time, and you can use the miner or a builder (or both) to turn the Climber.

[Minim]

I still managed to backroute it with my method. However, I've just thought of an even better idea:

Spoiler

Use Pickup skills! My backroute requires all six builders, none of which are needed to build over the lake. If you exchange a builder from the skillset for pickup skill and place it next to the lake, I have no chance to backroute your level

Hope this helps.

[Crane]

That would work, but I think you can still make it work using the miner instead of a builder, and the leftover basher to cut the climber's bridge short if necessary.  Admittedly I'm quite an old-school level designer and favour the classic eight tools only.  If it means a patched level though, then I may submit to the new!

It's funny... "The Wishing Well" was something I took a lot of pride in building, and it's been ripped to shreds in many different ways.  Hmmm!

[IchoTolot]

Made a quick video with the solutions to my levels:    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xp6A0zOo52A

[namida]

If there's any last-minute updates / late submissions, there's about 6 hours left to get them in. After this, late entries / updates will close, and a few days later, voting will open. Public replay sharing / discussion is still allowed until voting begins.

If any more updates / submissions do come, the update phase will remain open until we've had 72 hours without any further updates / submissions.

[Nepster]

Here the intended solution to my level.

[Crane]

I would have made updates to "The Wishing Well", but given my on-going computer problems (my laptop's hard drive is rapidly failing) and the way people have torn the level asunder, I'll be leaving it for now.  I'll patch it up and all when it comes to releasing it for my own pack one day, maybe.  I'll have to try to post my intended solutions too.

[Proxima]

I'm not going to be able to make the level I wanted to contribute. I have an idea for one, but I just haven't had time to build it. Sorry

[geoo]

I had a go at all the NeoLemmix levels now as well. After talking to Icho it seems like the latest released nxp doesn't have the latest versions of the styles, making the exit in zanzindorf's level not work and the traps in the dune tileset hard to spot.

I'm one skill short of solving BulletRide's complications, and I didn't save a replay after gathering everyone in front of the exit in Bird Knight, but I have replays for all other levels.
Comments:

[V6] BulletRide's "Complications" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

Very tough one, and the start is still not clear to me. But really nice interaction between the swimmer and the climber as far as I can see. I'll try it again at some point.

[V16] Crane's "The Wishing Well" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

This was quite fun. Some of the terrain is a bit strange and the skill placements feel unnatural (like the builder at the top), but I guess that's a side-effect of backroute fixing, as other parts of the level look very nice. The cross at the right is a bit misleading as it looks like it'd turn the climber around, the level could make that a bit clearer here. But overall I enjoyed figuring this one out. Time limit was a bit tight at the end; is it needed for backroute prevention?

[V1] Gronkling's "Future Temple" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

I like how simplistic this one is with just 5 skills. Still it takes a little while to figure out, I was having a lot of fun with this one. Only gripe is that depending on exact placement of the basher/blocker, the blocker sometimes goes into the traps. Oh, and I feel like the traps aren't as visible as they could be, but that's an issue with the tile set.

[V3] IchoTolot's "The Machine" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

Really fun this one. I didn't realize that by platforming at the top, you create a safe fall due to the updraft. Then the level was more straightforward than expected. But it still has the nice timing falling into place at the end which is very satisfying.

[V3] Colorful Arty's "Lego my lemmings!" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

This was one of the easier ones, but still fun to play.

[V3] Crane's "Heaven and Earth" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

Definitely one of my favourites. At the beginning it seems like there are almost no options at all, but then there are surprisingly many things to try out. Took me a while, and I was thoroughly enjoying it. I'm glad Simon made me aware of the time limit from the start, still once or twice I had the level end abruptly because the timer ran out. Not a big fan of that happening.

[V5] Colorful Arty's "Hailfire Peaks" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

I feel like the terrain looks a bit messy in this one. The level itself really it built around the terrain, but there are not many options for the skill placements. I took a little while to realize the basher trick, even though I had used it in a level of my own before. The miner placements together with the blocker are a bit annoying to get right.

[V1] Gronkling's "Ursa Miner? Ursa MAJOR!" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

Really cute level. Looked impossible for a moment, but once I saw the main trick it didn't take long to piece it together. I really like how compact the level is.

[V2] IchoTolot's "Harkonnen Force" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

The level isn't bad itself, but it caused me a lot of frustration which is mostly the tileset's fault. The version from the first post still doesn't have the markings for the trap, so it looks like terrain. That messed up my plans. Then the teleporter destinations look almost like the teleporters, so I thought they were two-way and was planning a solution around that. That messed up my plans again. Then it also wasn't quite clear where the trigger area of the fire is, whether you can actually dig down off-center. Once I actually saw the level as it was it wasn't so hard. Nothing completely novel and the middle felt a bit like filler, but an ok level.

[V3] zanzindorf's "Bird Knight" (NeoLemmix)

Spoiler

I like the visuals of this one, and the level itself plays nicely too. It looks like you have plenty of skills, but you need at least a little bit of planning to make sure you don't run out.

[namida]

I'll open the voting at some point (most likely earlier rather than later) on the 17th, UTC. (Don't want to give an exact time, as that relies on me being able to do so at whatever the exact time is.)

If you want to get in any last-minute discussion, do so now.