NeoLemmix editor --- Music selection

[IchoTolot]

So I started using the NeoLemmix Editor to create levels for the contests. The possibility to choose the right music directly in the editor was one of my favorite new features

But (sry for maybe a little bit harsher language here ):

Finding the right track is a pain!

You only see the numbers, so I had to test and switch through them ~ 5 min to get the one I wanted and that's no fun at all! 
So I am wondering: Why don't the editor use the actual songnames   (like  "Who's that doggy in the window"  for an example)

I mean nobody says my favorite music track is track 27 in my music folder. No you say my favorite music track is Interpret XY with the song XY.
And it is a waste of time when you must search for right track everytime!

This way of displaying the track names instead of numbers has even more advantages if you want to add more great tracks to the selection (which I am planning to do so for my future NeoLemmix port of Reunion):

1.)
New custom tracks could be added way more easily! (and by everyone with every track they want)
If person A want to add new tracks at position 38 and 39, but person B also wants to add other tracks with the same numbers -> there will be chaos!
And after some good tracks have been added to the selection you might have ~ 100 tracks which all have a reason to stay in, but you simply can't say which one is which, unless you make txt file where everything is listed and why adding that when you can simply just put the real titles in the editor.
I would maybe go even further and attach a music folder to the editor and players where everyone can put in the tracks which they want to use (editor reads the tracks out of this folder and displays the names in the selection screen) and if they spread a level to other people, they simply spread the track with it (and put it also in the players music folder).

2.)
Different versions of the same track will be much easier to handle! Just sort them alphabetically and write " Genesis" or "Dos" behind the track.
Now you would just have number 4 and 56 and good luck seperating them!

3.)
You said it already for tilesets in the NeoLemmix Community Pack thread:

Yep, that's right. Although the editor contains presets for some other NeoLemmix-based games, you don't usually need to worry about this anymore, as unlike traditional Lemmix which relies on a graphic set number, NeoLemmix relies on a graphic set name and only uses the number as a fallback (if for example, the name isn't recognized, or when loading a traditional Lemmix level). Thus, I recommend just using NeoCustLemmix, as it contains all the graphic sets and VGASPECs from the official games (even including the Genesis ones), as well as those from Lemmings Plus and Doomsday Lemmings.

And why are the music tracks any different! Even more:
They are usually waaaaaaaaaay more music tracks then tilesets. In my lemmini music folder I can choose from over 150 tracks and I can select a specific one in under 5 sec, because I know the song name.


So in my opinion this way the really awesome music selection feature will be much more easier to use and expand.

[namida]

You have some good points there. Some thoughts:

1. Obviously, there'd need to be some way of labelling them; whether that's the main reference being the name (and associating them with a number), or the reverse. The reason for this is due to the default fallback of rotating tracks (not as relevant in NeoCustLemmix level packs since it just picks randomly, but it would be important for Flexi-based packs).
2. Generally, small (NeoCustLemmix-type) packs don't tend to have their own music, or anything other than levels. Thus, I don't see the feature as being as important here. Larger packs of course will not be suited to NeoCustLemmix, and instead would need use of Flexi; in this case, the pack creator has full control over the numbering / ordering / etc of the musics anyway.
3. The editor would also need to handle more to do with musics than it currently does. All it's doing at the moment is saving and loading a number from the level file; it has no idea what that number actually means.
4. Currently, the order of tracks (or at least the Orig) ones actually differs depending on what set of musics you're using. The Amiga (default musics) order is the same as the Genesis one, but the rest differ - Master System differs only slightly, while DOS is completely different. Apart from Genesis, these are designed to match the order of the tracks on the actual systems, rather than keeping the same track at the same position across all styles. To be fair, this is probably something I should consider changing (at least as far as possible; in some cases (particularly Master System) some of the tracks are different altogether - Master System is lacking four of the tracks found in other versions, while it adds four new ones (Miniature Overture, Scotland the Brave, Don't Dilly-Dally All The Way, and one track that appears to be an entirely original composition); you probably noticed this when playing LPI which uses Master System musics.)

No versions of the musics other than the Amiga ones are going to be included by default with the player / editor anytime soon. If you look at the size of the optional music packs; you'll notice they're often much bigger than the players themself. Actually including these other version tracks would, thus, increase the filesize of the player by that much.


Don't take this as a "it won't happen", though. If there's enough interest, I can definitely consider it.

[IchoTolot]

1. Obviously, there'd need to be some way of labelling them; whether that's the main reference being the name (and associating them with a number), or the reverse. The reason for this is due to the default fallback of rotating tracks (not as relevant in NeoCustLemmix level packs since it just picks randomly, but it would be important for Flexi-based packs).

If it is   "24 Who's that doggy" it would be a real improvement!
And you would have the number for the label and the name for the player.

2. Generally, small (NeoCustLemmix-type) packs don't tend to have their own music, or anything other than levels. Thus, I don't see the feature as being as important here. Larger packs of course will not be suited to NeoCustLemmix, and instead would need use of Flexi; in this case, the pack creator has full control over the numbering / ordering / etc of the musics anyway.

Ok, I see the point there. The Flexi thing I did not know, but I must say: I am more a fan of having a real pack folder where you can change every level+music file contained there on the fly, instead of having just the single pack.exe, which you have to change entirely when you update a level. But that just might be personal preference.

[namida]

There's two versions of Flexi, actually. One indeed works on pretty much like a pack folder - you can just drop files in and they work. The other, known as the "Toolkit" version; is for building that EXE when you're ready to distribute your game.

[IchoTolot]

Ok, I will check this out when the "converting the pack" time has come! But for now fixing all the stuff in the Lemmini version comes first on the list.

[607]

Hm, I actually don't have any problems just keeping a text file. It doesn't take too long to look it up there, especially because you can use ctrl + F.

[IchoTolot]

Hm, I actually don't have any problems just keeping a text file. It doesn't take too long to look it up there, especially because you can use ctrl + F.

It doesn't take long, but it takes time (even if it is only a few secs) and why make it complicated with opening (and keeping) another txt file in the folder when you can simply put a name behind the number in the program.
Yeah it might not be a big thing to open a txt, but one of the main goals of the editor should be to keep it as simple to use as possible and dont rely on txt files in the folder to explain things which  can be easily explained in the editor itself.

[607]

I agree. I think, if this doesn't take too much time to implement, this would be a good thing to do.
There may be better things to do right now though, achievements, for example.

[namida]

Achievements is pretty much completed. The achievement editor itself still needs some improvement, but player-side it's already complete (just not released yet, aside from the trial update versions of LPI and LPII that demonstrate the feature).

While I don't see a change to how it's handled behind-the-scenes coming too soon, I'll see what I can do about making the selection a bit more user-friendly (perhaps add support to the editor for reading an INI file to get a list of numbers; of course the editor would come with some default INI files for the default music list).

[namida]

Alright so, I'm going to work on implementing support for music via name rather than via number. I'll add support for *loading* levels that do this in the next player update (V1.34n-B / V1.35n, whichever it is), but I'll wait a few more versions before adding support to the editor; this way by the time any levels are using it, most people should have a player version that supports it.

EDIT: Support for loading this is now implemented and will be included in the next version. But, as mentioned, I'll wait a couple more versions before adding editor support for it.