NeoLemmix Community Pack

[Ron_Stard]

You can send me the slightly modified version of Honi Soit. I don't look at replays of the intended solution as I don't want to spoil myself with the solution yet. If I do get really stuck, I'll send you an attempt replay.

PM sent!

[Dullstar]

I'd like to request the removal of The Sweltering Warehouse and T=0K, as those will be used in my upcoming pack.

Also, just a thought, but I'm wondering if we can include some the levels from the canceled Epic Lemmings Fangame that Dullstar originally started?

The levels submitted for that fangame were:
Dullstar: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3
GigaLem: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3
Fernito: Pack (Clonic Inferno and Dilemma cannot be used as they are already part of Revenge of the Lemmings)

Any of my levels from that project are fine for it except "To The Death" just because I don't like that one.  If you're interested in using any of those levels, though, do let me know, because I think I can bring some minor improvements to some of them (e.g. removing unnecessary space in "Suicidal Lemming x2," removing all time limits, anti-frustration terrain modifications, removal of *blatant* backroutes (I tend not to mind if my levels have alternate solutions but there's one that's got an egregiously bad backroute in it).

[GigaLem]

I'd like to request the removal of The Sweltering Warehouse and T=0K, as those will be used in my upcoming pack.

Also, just a thought, but I'm wondering if we can include some the levels from the canceled Epic Lemmings Fangame that Dullstar originally started?

The levels submitted for that fangame were:
Dullstar: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3
GigaLem: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3
Fernito: Pack (Clonic Inferno and Dilemma cannot be used as they are already part of Revenge of the Lemmings)

Any of my levels from that project are fine for it except "To The Death" just because I don't like that one.  If you're interested in using any of those levels, though, do let me know, because I think I can bring some minor improvements to some of them (e.g. removing unnecessary space in "Suicidal Lemming x2," removing all time limits, anti-frustration terrain modifications, removal of *blatant* backroutes (I tend not to mind if my levels have alternate solutions but there's one that's got an egregiously bad backroute in it).

Gonna get this off my chest, I kinda cringe looking at my old levels and i mean very old ,so count my epic levels out

[namida]

I haven't actually played these levels, but they look very good visually at least. o_O

[Nepster]

I'd like to request the removal of The Sweltering Warehouse and T=0K, as those will be used in my upcoming pack.

Also, just a thought, but I'm wondering if we can include some the levels from the canceled Epic Lemmings Fangame that Dullstar originally started?

The levels submitted for that fangame were:
Dullstar: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3
GigaLem: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3
Fernito: Pack (Clonic Inferno and Dilemma cannot be used as they are already part of Revenge of the Lemmings)

Having recently played Dullstar's and Fernito's level packs to update them, here is (what I consider to be) a best-of list:

• Dullstar - epic01.dat - level 1 - Attack of the Killer Toddlers: If we don't yet have a similar level, then this one is an easy and fun version of the trick. The decoration on the sides should be made smaller though.
• Dullstar - epic01.dat - level 4 - The Ice Palace : Very nice, little and relatively easy level.
• Dullstar - epic01.dat - level 10 - The Lemmings Plead for Help: Nice level around the question "How do I distribute my skills?". Some walking distances could be shorter though.
• Dullstar - epic02.dat - level 9 - The Waffle Express: Very good looking and fun level with multiple (though similar) solutions.
• Dullstar - epic03.dat - level 4 - One-Way Rock: This has a shortcut by going directly through/over the block in the middle. Without this, this level had the potential to become a very good one.
• Dullstar - epic03.dat - level 5 - Save the top, free the bottom: Nice, easy level.
• Fernito - epic - level 3 - Lemmings cemetery: Very clever level. Good looking as well.
• Fernito - epic - level 10 - Wish it was 13...: Hard and interesting level. It admits multiple variations of the solution while keeping the main idea.

[Dullstar]

I'm not certain, and I'd have to test in regular Lemmix, but I think the backroute in One-Way Rock might be NeoLemmix-only because of the different OWW handling. Experimentally I gave the pieces above the rock the one-way tag as well, and now the backroute doesn't work/isn't as easy to pull off.  I'm going to update it, however, so this change won't be needed.

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EDIT TO AVOID DOUBLE POST:

I've updated two of the levels Nepster mentioned. They are based off of Nepster's NeoLemmix conversions (hope you're okay with that) but have additional fixes.
In addition, I've provided an additional level from these NeoLemmix conversions, that I'm thinking of redesigning, so I'd like to see what people like/don't like about it.

A note about the backroute definition: Just because a solution isn't covered by the backroute definition doesn't guarantee that the solution isn't a backroute. It just sets an idea of what would definitely be considered a backroute, and how lenient the solution may be. Some levels are, of course, more open ended than others.

Changelog for "Save the top, free the bottom"

Spoiler

Removed time limit
Added tops to the exits
Removed unused skills from skillset

Backroute Definition:

Spoiler

This level is open ended; any solution that works goes.

Changelog for "One-Way Rock"

Spoiler

Can no longer bypass one way arrows.
Removed time limit
Redesigned much of the level around one of the possible solutions for the original.
Added one-way down arrows to the first obstacle to the right of the entrance to prevent backroutes.
Design no longer relies on the top edge of the map being solid.
Removed unused skills from skillset.
Facelift

Backroute Definition:

Spoiler

Any solution that does not use a climber on both sides of the entrance is a backroute (one to climb over the one-way down arrow obstacle, one to climb up the gap to the left of the entrance). (I don't believe you don't need to use both provided climbers, but it is faster)
Any solution that deviates SIGNIFICANTLY from the intended solution (see replay of intended solution) is a backroute.
Note that the floaters are there for safety, and are not actually required to solve the level.
There should be slightly more builders than are needed to solve the level to give the player a little breathing room, so don't worry if you have a few extra.

[Dullstar]

I found a minor issue with the updated version of "Save the top, free the bottom" so I have fixed it.  There is no functional difference between the two versions; this updated version has simply been given a ceiling so that if you choose to use the provided climbers, the behavior of the top of the screen won't matter.

[Wafflem]

Here are my replays to the two levels. Not sure if One-Way Rock is a backroute, but it looks like it follows most of your guidelines on how the solution should not be a backroute.

[Dullstar]

Here are my replays to the two levels. Not sure if One-Way Rock is a backroute, but it looks like it follows most of your guidelines on how the solution should not be a backroute.

TL;DR for the upcoming description of your solution for One Way Rock:
It is not a backroute.  I got carried away in my description of why it's an acceptable solution (complete with screenshots!), so if you want to read it, there's a nice long explanation about it.

Close enough on One Way Rock.  My intended solution digs slightly further down the one-way-down obstacle and uses the miner from the left side of it, but I typically don't mind minor variations on my intended solutions, and your solution definitely counts as a minor variation.  It doesn't look like it would be too difficult to modify the level to enforce what I'd intended over your solution if I really wanted to but I don't think there's any reason to do so, since they're so similar.

Screenshots:

Spoiler

My solution is on the left, yours is on the right.  They are similar enough that I don't consider your solution to be a backroute.

You might notice that I used an extra basher.  When I choose my skillsets, I prefer to make things generous enough to avoid precise assignments when doing so won't create backroutes, so that basher is only there so you don't have to worry about the miner placement as much.

Your solution to the other level is pretty much identical to mine.

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I don't believe I mentioned this in the post where I submitted the levels, but I'm not horribly attached the names of them.  If anyone has a better idea for the names, just run it by me. If I'm okay with the alternate suggestion, it's perfectly fine with me to rename them.

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Should I avoid specifying music tracks?  I didn't really think about it when I originally submitted the levels, but since NeoLemmix has the ability to do so, I usually specify a track that I feel goes well with the level rather than using randomness or a set order.

For reference, One-Way Rock is set to orig_17 (Coming Around the Mountain).  The other level doesn't specify a track, probably because I made minimal changes to it, and therefore it required minimal testing.

[Wafflem]

Specifying music tracks is acceptable. Flopsy intentionally specified his music track for "Tell me the way to DMA" as the second music to Oh No More Lemmings, while Apjjm's "Thrown Out With the Bathwater" is specified as the sixth music to ONML.

Some people even like to put custom music; IchoTolot did this for many of his levels.

[Dullstar]

One thing I'm wondering about is training levels. Should we have some kind of training levels in this? Perhaps a dedicated rank for them, covering not just the new skills, but also the new types of objects?

Was scrolling through the posts in this thread, and am wonder if this was this ever decided?  If you want some training levels, I've got a pile of them lying around we could use.  I've made ones for all of the skills, plus a few relatively simple tricks that can be done with them.  There are also some for some of the new objects, although I did not finish them (the levels I have made with the new objects are finished, but I didn't get to all of the objects.  The radiation and slowfreeze objects have given me the most trouble; there's a level for slowfreeze, but I don't like it.

If anyone's interested in taking a look at these levels, I'll upload them.

[Wafflem]

Hmmm...we already have training levels in the NeoLemmix Introduction Pack. But I'm still interested to see the training levels, most especially the ones with the tricks.

If we want training levels to be part of the pack, I think they'd work in a "Training" rank.

[Nepster]

I found the interesting level "Panic Attack" by Sever in SeverSet4.dat and modified it slightly. The (intended) solution of the attached level works (up to minor modifications) already in the original level.

[Dullstar]

Level (not the tutorial ones I was talking about earlier though)!

I feel like this one's probably the hardest I've been able to come up with.  I can't decide if the skillset should contain an extra floater, but for the time being I've opted not to.

I wanted it to use builders instead of platformers, but the builders were causing a really egregious backroute that I couldn't figure out how to remove in a visually pleasing manner.  But I've uploaded both versions in case someone wants to see if they can edit the backroute out.

Dullstar-TestChamber.lvl is the version with the platformers - this does not have the backroute I found, but that doesn't mean there aren't others.
Dullstar-TestChamber-Experimental.lvl has builders instead of platformers, and an egregious backroute.  Like I said, I've uploaded in case someone wants to try their hand at removing it without making the level ugly or changing most of the builders to platformers.

I hope it's okay if it uses one of the auto-downloading tilesets.  One of the contest levels used this set and I liked how it looked.

[Nepster]

Not sure, what is intended... but almost certainly not this solution. (recorded with the experimental version)