Zendo, play by forum

[Proxima]

Funny time to drop extra hints, when the game has started to move again after a lull. If no-one posted for a few days, then you'd have every reason to think we might need a bit of help.

SUQ
GGGGGGMIGHTY
MIGHTYYYYYYY
MIGHTZZZZZ
EEEEFIRE
IIIIFIRE

[namida]

White:
SUQ
MIGHTYYYYYYY
IIIIFIRE

Black:
GGGGGGMIGHTY
MIGHTZZZZZ
EEEEFIRE


The reason I thought to drop the hints is that we'd only had a small number of guesses since that lull, only one of which was a white koan.

[Proxima]

Hmm. I had an idea while I was swimming today, but now I look back, it doesn't quite fit everything so far. Still, I suspect it's close.

Theory: Length must be at least 3, and must be a factor of (alphabetic position - 1) of the most common letter. If multiple letters occur as the most common, the first appearing in the koan is the one that counts.

The following koans are the only ones so far that don't fit this rule:

white -- rule predicts black
FIRE
GAME
RIFE
SITE
SPAM
ZYA

black -- rule predicts white
FIREQ
FIRES
FIREY
FIRST
GIT
MIGHTYMIGHTY

[namida]

It's on the right track. (alphabetic position - 1) definitely does have something to do with it, as does factors of the length, but most common letter does not - however, thinking about that might lead you to the correct answer.

I would mention that one thing I previously stated would contradict your theory - that in the case of anagrams, the status won't change unless the first letter changes. Thus (ignoring all other elements but the most common letter thing), your theory would suggest ABBCC and ACCBB could possibly have a different outcome; but they could not as the first letter is unchanged. However, ABBCC and CCABB possibly could.

(For the record, all four of those example koans are, in fact, black.)

[namida]

Hm... gone quiet again. Maybe I should follow Proxima's suggestion and use times like this to drop a hint...

In fact, no. I'll drop part (albeit a minor part) of the rule.

Spoiler

Except for the purpose of "what is the length of the koan", one part of the rule can be thought of as "count the first letter twice". This is why a different first letter can impact the black/white status of a koan, but anagramming the rest of the koan (while keeping the first letter unchanged) cannot.

[namida]

Is it safe to say people have given up on this one?

If we go a couple days more without much interest, I'll reveal the rule, and someone else can make another round (or perhaps I'll do one with a simpler rule).

[Simon]

I'd lean towards ending the game, too.

It is common for new masters to make rules too hard on accident. You have noticed this surprisingly early, and then handled it really well by offering hints or an early end. It's much better this way than attempting to change the secret rule mid-game.

-- Simon

[namida]

Okay well,

The rule was:
Assigning each letter a number, where A = 0, B = 1 etc, a koan of at least three letters is white if the quantity of letters who's numbers are integer multiples of the length is equal or greater than the quantity of letters that are not, with the first letter being counted twice if it is a multiple.


If no one else wants to take the next game, I have an idea for a not-so-complicated rule.

[607]

I've reread that rule like five times, but I still don't really get it :confused:

[Proxima]

I'll go next, since I at least got closer than anyone else

EVEN has the Buddha-nature.
ODD does not have the Buddha-nature.

[namida]

EVAN
EVIN
EVON
EVUN
OOD
DDO
NEVE

[Proxima]

White:
EVEN
NEVE

Black:
DDO
EVAN
EVIN
EVON
EVUN
ODD
OOD

[Ramon]

EE
NN
VV
EVE
NEV
NEVER
GIVE
UP

[Proxima]

Asked and answered in chat: all anagrams of "EVEN" have the buddha-nature.

White:
EE
EVE
NN
NEVER
VV

Black:
DDO
EVAN
EVIN
EVON
EVUN
GIVE
NEV
ODD
OOD
UP

[namida]

EEVEE
SEE
EAGER
EEL
PETER