Lemmings Touch first impressions

[mobius]

This review is so in-depth and well-thought-out it almost makes me want to buy a PS Vita just to play this and see everything Prob Lem has mentioned for myself. Thank you for taking the time to write this!

Also, I'm glad that this new official Lemmings game has received so much love.

yeah me too. Shame the 90's custom of porting Lemmings to every system known to man isn't still going on...  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" class="smiley" />
If this was available in computer form, android or Nintento DS, I'd buy it instantly.
So far I don't have any games on my android phone. I don't really like the small screen and that's why I stopped playing my DS regularly a while ago.
Anyone know of anything in the emulator field with PS vita? [I did not read the whole thread so sorry if this was already answered]

[Luis]

I'm not sure if there's a PS Vita emulator that works. I found this one but he said it has lag and crashes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRvg5aDAjwA" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRvg5aDAjwA

Sony doesn't want Lemmings to be on a non-PlayStation platform. And besides I rather have more new levels than another Original Lemmings, with the old 120 levels which I can already and still play in the PSP.

[Prob Lem]

^ But did they not have the appeal because they weren't ported? Or were they not ported because of lack of appeal? I have to say, personally, I found L2 to be only average, and L3 horrible, compared to the original. L3D was fairly good though, and Revolution was quite impressive - now notice that these two (at least in some aspects) go back to basics? IDK haha. Just my random incoherent thoughts on it.

I don't really know which way the causality flows in each case (as we all know, sometimes it's ego that gets game series ended or hampered, and not the market itself - it's part of why other overlapping markets are now hitting the core games business so incredibly hard, because huge numbers of people more-or-less said "Hell with this - I'll go elsewhere."), but I really only meant that, in this case, this is a game that would definitely net a larger audience if it was only allowed to have one. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" class="smiley" />

I'm not sure how touch controls can be better than buttons and keyboard. I think with buttons and keyboard, you can do multi tasking more easier.

That wasn't my meaning - I meant that in the context of this game, certain things assigned to the Vita's physical controls would actually work just as well or better if placed on the touch-screen, because almost everything in-game is handled from there. It really feels like using the d-pad and a couple of buttons for certain functions wasn't the original plan, and that it was moved from mobile platforms to the Vita, instead (the "social media" sharing buttons on the post-level screens also strongly add to this impression - I don't believe I've ever seen this in a console game).

The fact that this has repeated levels means we might never see a new Lemmings game with 100+ that are not from previous games, except the ones made by fans because they have more free time to work on Lemmings than Sony does. They even said it will have both new and old levels here in the second paragraph: http://www.pushsquare.com/news/2013/08/gamescom_2013_wait_theres_a_new_lemmings_game_on_the_way" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">http://www.pushsquare.com/news/2013/08/gamescom_2013_wait_theres_a_new_lemmings_game_on_the_way

I worry about the same thing, though I'm honestly amazed that we even got this game. I'm fully not expecting another, ever, because no matter how good it is (and it is good!), nobody is going to play it due to its PS Vita exclusivity. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" class="smiley" />

As for the statement about old levels being included, the claim therein had me a bit confused http://www.lemmingsforums.com/index.php?topic=844.msg17705#msg17705" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">way back in this thread. I'll quote my old post for clarity;

I'm really sorry for the double-post, but I stumbled across this interesting little nugget of information, http://www.pushsquare.com/news/2013/08/gamescom_2013_wait_theres_a_new_lemmings_game_on_the_way" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">from here;

According to an interview with executive producer James Harkins on The Average Gamer, the platform holder has collaborated with various fansites to select the best stages from earlier games.

I'm just left asking one thing: When, or did they just never come here?

I seriously feel like I've missed something, here! Unless, of course, they don't mean Lemmings fan-sites.

Of course, having now played it, it feels like only random levels used in the PSP version were chosen, most of which are from the Amiga original anyway. I haven't seen anything from any other Lemmings games, as the claim would imply, at all.

And of course, I don't really know of any other Lemmings fan-sites with an active community, so I'm still left wondering who they asked about the levels. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

I'm pretty sure the new audience aren't going to noticed those levels are old, if the game was meant to target those people.

I just meant that the PS Vita is aimed at a "core" audience who might likely have played Lemmings previously. Some value-packs for the Vita in the UK actually include the PSP Lemmings as a download, even.

Of course, if you mean the same thing as I was trying (and likely failing) to say - that a phone/tablet audience, which is much larger and more likely to contain newcomers to the games wouldn't notice - I totally agree. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/thumbsup.gif" alt=":thumbsup:" title="Thumbs Up" class="smiley" />

If they wanted to bring back those levels, it would have been more interesting to have those levels with the new features added to them, like the evil Lemmings. This will effect the old solution but it will make the level look new.

Fully agreed on this. I do wish that's what they'd done, as it would make the repeats rather less tiresome. Again, it's not that the repeats are bad levels, it's just that they're drowning out truly excellent new content.

Well I think for L3 at least, we can definitely say "not ported because of lack of appeal".  Heck, the game itself was meant to have more tribes that would come out as future expansion packs (or so I've heard), but even that fell through, never mind ports.

The manual mentions the expansions (I've got a PDF of it here - I can dig up the relevant quote if you're interested). http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/smiley.gif" alt=":)" title="Smiley" class="smiley" /> The strange thing is, the manual also mentions credits for an unreleased port, which was apparently also mentioned in a seasonal catalogue for the platform in question - the 3DO; This would've been the only console version of the game (I wonder if its cancellation was tied to the decision to release the game incomplete? There surely wouldn't have been any way of adding the rest of the game, on that platform, as far as I know).

The irony here is, Chronicles was released at about the same time the Mega Drive and SNES versions of Lemmings 2 were, and seems to have been completely overshadowed by them. A shame, as I think it's a sadly under-appreciated game, whose issues seem to stem from someone deciding to rush and get it released unfinished (the final game even comes with an errata sheet explaining some quite major menu/save-system changes implemented after the manual went to print), and then release the rest later - an attitude that now hampers games more than ever, and probably one of the earliest examples of that problem.

[Luis]

Here's a list of all the old levels that has returned. None of the Dirt and Marble levels are here.

Easy
1. Origins and Lemmings - Original
2. A to B - PSP
3. Lemmings toast - PSP
4. Bridge Across, Mine Through - PSP
5. Patience - Original
6. Crystal point - PSP
7. Lemmingology - Original
8. Let's block and blow - Original

Tricky
9. One man does all the hard work - PSP
10.Gather round and break away - PSP
11.I've lost that Lemming feeling - Original
12.Been there, seen it, done it - Original
13.Chain reaction - PSP
14.Careless clicking costs lives - Original
15.If at first you don't succeed.. - Original
16.Wrong points of view - PSP
17.Just 17 - PSP
18.Livin' On The Edge - Original
19.All the 6's - Original

Taxing
20.Float in Light at Lemming Head Height - PSP
21.There's a lot of them about - Original
22.Feel the heat! - Original
23.Three steps to heaven - PSP
24.Lemming Drops - Original
25.Lend a helping hand.... - Original
26.King of the castle - Original (This has 22 builders and the steels were lowered) http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee91/Luis2_06/Kingofthecastle_zps668d27f7.jpg?t=1401946900" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee91/Luis2_06/Kingofthecastle_zps668d27f7.jpg?t=1401946900
27.Cascade - Original

Hard
28.Call in the bomb squad - Original
29. No justice for the hero - PSP
30.The Great Lemming Caper - Original
31.Release is the word - PSP
32.Mary Pop land - Original
33.Last one out is a rotten egg! - Original
34.Triple Trouble - Original
35.POOR WEE CREATURES! - Original
36.The Boiler Room - Original
37.Down, along up. In that order - Original
38.Curse of the Pharaohs - Original
39.Save Me - Original
40.Going up... - Original

This game has the PSP engine but not everything is the same. There is some differences. The Lemmings in the Vita can't walk in the ceiling like in the PSP, so they don't walk on top of the blue terrain in "Going up" and die. They turn around instead. I noticed something odd in this video at 0:55. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEDGlR5-6v4&list=PLTcWEfM2VB1KTIsRd5eD9MWug3fJ6ZtdE&index=19" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEDGlR5-6v4&list=PLTcWEfM2VB1KTIsRd5eD9MWug3fJ6ZtdE&index=19 When the Lemming stopped digging and became a builder, he didn't turn around. Instead he continue moving in the direction is was facing. No wonder he put the blocker up there. The flamethrower takes a longer time to shoot another fire. Does the solution where the Lemmings can fall through the gray part of the flamethrower still works in "Feel the heat!"?

[Prob Lem]

Ouch. Considering that the game has been promoted as having around 100 or so levels, that means almost half of them are repeats. Knowing that, I'm just going to skip them from here on out!

If that means I can't reach the last sets of levels in the game, so be it - I don't want to waste any more time on levels I've seen a lot of times before. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

[Luis]

The people that will get the most satisfaction of the game will probably be the ones that hasn't played Lemmings in a long time and has forgotten those old levels. On the bright side the game is using the improved mechanicals from the PSP. Bashing while the Lemming is building is easier. Anyone remembers that moment when a Lemming destroys the stairs when you make it him bash, because you didn't startled building on the right spot in DOS? Also using miner to free a blocker is easier. It was hard for me to find the correct spot to make the Lemming mine without him turning around. Note that I got back into Lemmings with the PSP, so I was surprised that these things are harder in the old one. Does the game has a editor? I read from a review that it doesn't have one.

[Prob Lem]

It doesn't have a level editor, no. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" class="smiley" />

Regarding Builders, though, annoyingly some of the blocks you can move with your fingers also destroy any parts of bridges that their pass through...

[Tiduas]

It saddens me to post this but...

I probably have around 20 levels left to complete now. The reason they aren't complete yet is because some of the levels are so insanely boring and tedious that I can't bring myself to finish them for the moment. These touch controls totally ruins the game in some cases. Either the game's expecting you to fine adjust around 5-15 canons/trampolines for perfect accuracy (something that the touch control can't give anyone mind you) and if only a few lemmings on the level can die your only choice is to go with some crazy luck on some of the stages since you have no clue on where the canons are shooting you. Either that, or the solution on the levels requires you to go around bugs like the stopper on tilting landscape, tedious multitasking that can get out of hand because you can't grab a platform since the controls won't let you.

Out of all the levels in this game the best ones are definitely the classic ones. When there are no objects to interact with the game is quite fun and I really enjoy most of the stages that plays like classic Lemmings. There are some new stages as well that make good use of the touch based puzzles, but there are way too many levels that shares the enjoyment level of working at a work you don't enjoy. Without payment.

I'm going to get through this one day or another since I'm really not the type to leave my games unfinished, but I'm pretty sure I've completed most of the more enjoyable levels by now since I skipped the ones that made me irritated in some way or another. I really looked forward to this game since it finally showed some life in the franchise that we all love and care for. But instead of going with this whole touch-oriented thing they should build onto what Lemmings 2 tried to do with new abilites to change the puzzles instead. Or at least make the new touch-based puzzles fun, because that's the main problem, they just aren't.

[Prob Lem]

It saddens me to post this but...

I probably have around 20 levels left to complete now. The reason they aren't complete yet is because some of the levels are so insanely boring and tedious that I can't bring myself to finish them for the moment. These touch controls totally ruins the game in some cases. Either the game's expecting you to fine adjust around 5-15 canons/trampolines for perfect accuracy (something that the touch control can't give anyone mind you) and if only a few lemmings on the level can die your only choice is to go with some crazy luck on some of the stages since you have no clue on where the canons are shooting you. Either that, or the solution on the levels requires you to go around bugs like the stopper on tilting landscape, tedious multitasking that can get out of hand because you can't grab a platform since the controls won't let you.

It saddens me, too, but I must agree - as the game goes on, this becomes an increasing problem. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" class="smiley" />

I think a lot of the new levels are pretty good, myself, but it is disheartening to slog through a bunch of repeats, only to encounter a new level which is rendered nearly (or completely) impossible to complete due to the controls quite literally physically not allowing for it...

It's a shame, as the game got off to such a great start!

EDIT: While I think of it, since you're further in the game than I've had time for yet, roughly how many levels do the Mischievous Lemmings actually get to appear in?

I really looked forward to this game since it finally showed some life in the franchise that we all love and care for.

Same here. It's very clear that those responsible for Lemmings Touch, d3t, have their hearts in the right place, and care about the series, though. I think the problem is that Sony are the ones calling the shots, and they've proven time and again that they really don't care about Lemmings all that much...

It's inspired me to try my hand at designing some levels for Lix, though (as soon as I can figure out where the level editor is!), because the way I see it, the future of the series, or at least the genre, is with us, now.

[ccexplore]

It's inspired me to try my hand at designing some levels for Lix, though (as soon as I can figure out where the level editor is!)

Lix has the editor built into same program you used for playing levels.  You can go to the pinned post of our Lix board here to find a download link to latest version of Lix.  Whine to Simon if you find anything confusing or broken with it.  Unfortunately that may include the possibility of the game not running well at all for you (it depends partly on the specifics of your computer), as a few others have reported (issues being worked on but not an easy problem; at least such cases are in the minority).

[Prob Lem]

It's inspired me to try my hand at designing some levels for Lix, though (as soon as I can figure out where the level editor is!)

Lix has the editor built into same program you used for playing levels.  You can go to the pinned post of our Lix board here to find a download link to latest version of Lix.  Whine to Simon if you find anything confusing or broken with it.  Unfortunately that may include the possibility of the game not running well at all for you (it depends partly on the specifics of your computer), as a few others have reported (issues being worked on but not an easy problem; at least such cases are in the minority).

Oh, it runs great (compiled it myself to get around an issue with the audio, though) - I just quite literally have no idea how to get to actually editing levels, due to not seeing any such thing. Am I missing a shortcut or something? http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

[mobius]

It's inspired me to try my hand at designing some levels for Lix, though (as soon as I can figure out where the level editor is!)

Lix has the editor built into same program you used for playing levels.  You can go to the pinned post of our Lix board here to find a download link to latest version of Lix.  Whine to Simon if you find anything confusing or broken with it.  Unfortunately that may include the possibility of the game not running well at all for you (it depends partly on the specifics of your computer), as a few others have reported (issues being worked on but not an easy problem; at least such cases are in the minority).

Oh, it runs great (compiled it myself to get around an issue with the audio, though) - I just quite literally have no idea how to get to actually editing levels, due to not seeing any such thing. Am I missing a shortcut or something? http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

go to single player>single>any folder if there are no levels in "single" [just find any level and you can select levels that will appear in the list>on the right should be a play and edit button> press edit> then in the editing screen on the lower left there's a button with a page "new" button---this erases the level and makes a new one.
[there is no "create new level" option]
hope this helps  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/smiley.gif" alt=":)" title="Smiley" class="smiley" />

Be sure to save your level as something different or it will erase over the old one I think.. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/undecided.gif" alt=":-\" title="Undecided" class="smiley" />

[ccexplore]

I just quite literally have no idea how to get to actually editing levels, due to not seeing any such thing. Am I missing a shortcut or something? http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

Hmm, so I guess already the UI may be in trouble, perhaps you should whine to Simon about it. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/undecided.gif" alt=":-\" title="Undecided" class="smiley" /> http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" /> Anyway, you're right, there is no button directly in the main menu (where you have other buttons like "single", "options", "replays", etc.) for editor.  Instead you go to either "single" or "multiplayer", ie. their screen for selecting levels.  There you'd notice that you have both a "Play" button as well as an "Edit" button, the latter is how you get into the editor.

A further gotcha is that Lix tries to remember the last level you played/edited and may automatically select that when you go to the level selection screen, and the only way (that I know of) to "deselect" is to navigate into another directory.  With no levels actually selected, the "Edit" button will start you off from scratch.  Otherwise it actually loads the selected level for you to edit it.  Of course in the latter case, you can still find buttons in the editor screen to wipe the level clean and then save it under a different filename, to get the same effect as starting a new level from scratch.

[Tiduas]

It saddens me, too, but I must agree - as the game goes on, this becomes an increasing problem. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" class="smiley" />

I think a lot of the new levels are pretty good, myself, but it is disheartening to slog through a bunch of repeats, only to encounter a new level which is rendered nearly (or completely) impossible to complete due to the controls quite literally physically not allowing for it...

It's a shame, as the game got off to such a great start!

EDIT: While I think of it, since you're further in the game than I've had time for yet, roughly how many levels do the Mischievous Lemmings actually get to appear in?

It makes me feel better that I'm not the only one thinking like this. It seems that we think mostly the same about the game. Regarding how many Mischievous Lemmings-levels there are I can't really answer but in the end they pop up a little now and then so... maybe 20-25 levels or something like that I'm really bad at estimating stuff like this it seems. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/smiley.gif" alt=":)" title="Smiley" class="smiley" />

Anyway, I'm finally done with the game! 100%, got my nice looking platinum trophy and all. I might have been a little too harsh on the game when I posted yesterday, but I still think that the games gives off quite a bitter taste in the end anyway.

[Luis]

Tiduas your post is inside the quote. I never played the game due to the fact it's for the Vita, which I don't even want. You're not alone in the disappointment. I think the game is meh, after watching a walkthrough. I'm not digging the touch controls and too many old levels that I already played to death in the PSP looks lazy. Maybe they didn't have enough time to make 100 unique ones? Having no editor shortens it's replay value but then again, what's the point of an editor if nobody is gonna play your levels? Sure they could make a online server where you can upload and download levels, but that will become inactive later on, like what happened in the PSP. Although you can still have fun making levels for yourself to play. That's what I did when the server was taken down. So far the best Lemmings that Sony made is the PSP. That's probably because it's a port of the Original Lemmings, which is the best and most popular Lemmings in the series.