[PC][RPG] Legends of an Otherworld

[namida]

Using RPG Maker VX Ace, and since I'm no artist, I'm using default or freely-available graphics. The storyline is... well, not horrible (it's definitely no FFX-2), but it's nothing overly amazing either. The real shining point is the gameplay; the battles will give even good RPG players a run for their money.

The battle system is closely based off Final Fantasy 10, but the difficulty is... yeah, let's just say it puts FFX to shame and leave it at that. xD I'm sure you guys can at least partly guess from my Lemmings levels the sort of things I might come up with.

The first few bosses are more or less easy things to get you into it (though the 2nd and 3rd have been reported to give some people trouble), the 6th boss is where you really have to start thinking. =P

Map images. Spoiler-free.

Battle images. Spoiler-free.

Scanning can reveal useful information about enemies.

Blue magic works in a unique way. Instead of directly costing MP, you must charge BP and use that to cast it. The advantage is that Blue Magic is generally very powerful, or otherwise very useful.

Scanning can reveal status vulnerabilities too.

Battle video. Mild strategy spoilers for an early-game boss.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuNp4d3EMhg

Note that as an early-game boss, this only shows a fraction of the various options available to you in combat. There's MUCH more to discover beyond this!

This game is now complete and is only being updated to fix bugs.

Current version: V026b
Fresh download: https://1drv.ms/u/s!Am6NTdy4vnPXhjBxJ5DdppjLWtil
Steam Workshop: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1252703211

It requires the RPG Maker VX Ace RTP, which you can get here: http://www.rpgmakerweb.com/download/additional/run-time-packages
Make sure you get the VX Ace one, not the standard VX one.

[ccexplore]

I have to say it's pretty decent and well made. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/thumbsup.gif" alt=":thumbsup:" title="Thumbs Up" class="smiley" /> It is very much in the overall style of the FF games back in the SNES era, great for the nostalgia factor.  Though I have to say I haven't seen the wraparound dungeons before in those games (granted, I'm not that big a player of RPG games), that is kinda innovative.

Interesting that the choice is made to make thing suddenly more difficult at the 6th boss, given all the discussion we've had around here about the diffculty curve in the original Lemmings levels (as in, these levels should've come before/after those levels, yada yada).  Seems like you're going for the opposite here then?

I know you said you don't visit here often, but I'm sorry, I'm not going to open a new account in some random board just to post about the game, so if I find any bugs or issues I'm just gonna post here.  Here's one:  see screenshot.  At the point in game when you're going up the mountains, if you talk to the boss characters (ie. the blond chick next to the white-hair dude) instead of to Harley (which would normally trigger the line of dialog leading to the boss battle), the game freezes.

======================

Since you brought up Android and iOS on another thread, I'm curious whether any free RPG makers out there currently provide cross-platform support particularly with mobile platforms such as at least Android.  You may well reach a much larger user base if people can download and play the game on those platforms as well.

[namida]

Just got GTA5 so playing that at the moment, but I did have a quick look at the code. There should be literally no difference - talking to Harley moves you to the space to the left of him, makes you face upwards (if you aren't already) then activates a switch. Talking to Brianna directly, since yu're already in that space and facing up, directly activates the switch. I'll have to have a closer look obviously.

The difficulty curve is fairly constant (with, just like in my Lemmings levels, the occasional extra-hard or extra-easy thrown in); it'd be more accurate to say the 6th boss is the first extra-hard one. However, more than half of the bosses before him also serve as somewhat of a test that you're getting the idea of the mechanics than meant to be actual challenges (though Craig + Brianna have been known to give people trouble). It can also depend on your playstyle - for example, at one point there's two bosses more or less in a row, we'll just refer to them with the initals DR and DT for here. Those who stay relatively low-level and rely extensively on strategy will have quite a hard time with DR due to his combination of punishing you for piling on damage too quickly (which a higher level party is more able to handle) and having Auto-Regen. On the other hand, brute forcing your way through DT is practically impossible; if your strategy is really bad he can even take down a Level 99 party, though that'd require you to be pretty bad... more realistically though, a player who has some understanding but isn't thinking much, DT would probably beat their Level 50-ish party. (Intended level for that point is around level 30, though I've done both of them at only slightly over half of that).

I don't know of any dedicated RPG Makers for mobile OSes. Multimedia Fusion 2 is a general game-making program that these days supports most platforms for output (including iOS, Android and even Xbox 360), but it's not free - and the compilers for anything other than Windows are an extra cost on top of the program itself. It's also not the best suited to RPGs, though it's most certianly possible to make.

I'm guessing you don't use Facebook either? The page there is generally the best way to contact me. But if not, just post it here, I do come here at least once in a while even at the times when I disappear for ages (I often don't post for like a year, but I still visit a few times througout that) so I'll see it eventually.

[ccexplore]

Thanks for the info.  I have spoilered the first boss that gave me some trouble (but I eventually did beat).  Sounds like a case of needing to level up more, or is that more or less how you expect this one to go?  (Unfortunately at this early point in the game, leveling up is pretty boring and grindy I have to say.)  Or did I miss a trick or two that would've made things go a lot smoother?

With the Transient, my party of 4 was originally at levels 7 and 8.  Eventually I raised their levels slightly to 8 (and 9 for the black mage characters, since it only took a small amount of additional EXPs after the other characters all hit level 8).  I also bought and equipped everyone with Agi+5% since the boss has higher agility and with its rather powerful attacks (and apparent immunity to almost all statuses except from the 4 "softening sand" given to you for this battle), I need my party to squeeze in as many turns as possible.  Even then, it is tricky when my party's HP hovers around 300s-400s (though thankfully one character is more like 600s)--the attacks being received easily takes out half the HP of the afflicted even with the best of preparation.

I had the two Sarin characters use their "stand ground" ability (counterattack) to increase damage potential especially when Trauma comes and everyone need to defend.  This works especially well as one of them has a regular physical attack which is the highest damage I can afflict, at slightly over 200 HP damage to the boss (and double that if I luck up on a critical hit).  Otherwise the black mage character deals out okay (and not status-dependent) damage with elementals at around 100 HP.  I also noticed that Phoenix Down revives a character to half his/her max HP, so in many cases it works out better to just let a single character (especially the one with highest HP) die and get revived.  With that in mind I stocked up a little on Phoenix Downs (Potions are plentiful with random battles right outside town at the swamps).

Ultimately I think the biggest source of difficulty is the high damage dealt, compare with the meager means I have for healing.  White mage's Cure can't target-all AFAIK, and that character isn't especially agile, so you really need Potions to deal with that big Trauma attack every 3 turns.  Potions heal only 75 compare with the 150+ damage from Trauma even with Defend.  And it's not like the shop (nor random battles) is offering better items like Potion Plus, so it isn't even a case of buying/stealing better items (yes, by that point you do pick up one or two Potion Plus and Elixirs, but I'd rather not use them so soon if I can).

At this early point in the game, there seems to be such a limited (and relatively crappy) selection of items, abilities and equipment, I think my options are just rather limited in how to deal with this battle, so it is challenging but not necessarily in a fun way for me.  I will grant you the possibility that maybe there is supposed to be a more specific pattern on how to attack the boss that might led to less damages received?  If such a magic sequence of moves exist I certainly haven't found it, beyond the general pattern to help you Defend for Trauma.

I do have to admit though, it is satisfying to beat the boss with all these things stacked against you.  I even manage to (barely) keep everyone alive at the final move so that all 4 can get their share of AP gains.

[ccexplore]

I have played through a few more bosses at this point (though I don't think I've yet reached the DR/DT point you mentioned), and I can definitely say that those bosses were easier to handle compare with that earlier "T" one I had trouble with.  Not easy mind you, but nowhere as unbalanced as the T battle.  Granted, I suppose occasional out-of-whack difficulties is intended and to be expected for your game.  I'm sure for example most people would get stuck at that dungeon where your options are math vs mapping out a maze (thankfully I know my math and much appreciate having that "shortcut" available), so maybe the extra difficulty of that early boss is a good warning anyway on what's to come. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/undecided.gif" alt=":-\" title="Undecided" class="smiley" /> http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/devil.gif" alt=":evil:" title="Evil" class="smiley" />  Still curious to know whether I was more under-leveled than intended for the T.

I ran into a few more (relatively minor) bugs as well, but it'd probably be more efficient if I wait until I finish the game before posting about them.

[namida]

He is quite a tricky one. While he CAN be beaten at even lower levels than you did at, I'm generally around the Level 9-10 mark for him (keep in mind I generally play RPGs, including my own, somewhat underlevelled), while others generally report being around level 12.

He does have one noticable weakness, though it's something that you'd have to resort to "try everything" to find due to his Scan immunity - kind of there as a reward to people who bother to do that (this isn't always the case with every boss, but some do reward you for trying obscure methods that might not be expected to work). Specifically in this case,

He is vunerable to Zombie - Tara and Leanna can learn Zombie Attack at level 15+, while Amanda can learn the spell Curse at any level. This allows you to use Harley's healing spells to deal some extra damage if you get spare turns. However - trying "zombie, elixir" to one-hit him won't work; he's immune to percentage-based damage (as are most bosses).

Beyond that, it's a matter of balancing attack and defence well, and taking care on where exactly you apply your healing. There's also...

one optional boss that can be fought before him (yes, I have these placed all throughout the game, not just towards the end), who drops a Hyperlixir (fully heals all members' HP and MP). This can be quite useful for that fight, though it's a very rare item so if you obtained it you may want to save it for later. By the time you're up to Transient, the optional guy isn't really that hard to beat.

[ccexplore]

I ran into a few more (relatively minor) bugs as well, but it'd probably be more efficient if I wait until I finish the game before posting about them.

Except I think I will mention now this bug I'm running into now rather than wait later, as it is frequently affecting me during my current point in the game, though perhaps others with different playing styles will be much less affected:  Escaping from a battle scrambles the party formation.  No big deal when there are no more than 4 members in the party, but once you hit 5 or higher, it means you end up with characters who aren't in battle swapped with those who are.  (For example, if current formation is A,B,C,D,E so that E is not in battle, after escaping out of battle back onto the map, you likely end up with something like eg. E,C,D,B,A [exact order likely depends on the exact order the characters escape with, I guess], so that A is no longer in battle while E is.

Since you can switch characters in-battle without sacrificing turns, I can live with this but it's an issue that can really get in your face.

[namida]

I'm aware of it, and it'll be fixed in the next major update, ie V018. (I generally only fix things that are either game-breaking or VERY simple in minor updates (017A, 017B etc).) Thanks for pointing it out all the same.

Just in case you hadn't realised, you can also re-order out of battle using the Formation option in the menu. Obviously not an ideal solution to be doing it after every battle, but it's at least there for before bosses.

That bug was unfortunately a side effect of the way I handled in-battle switching - or rather, fixing a glitch with Escape that got introduced when in-battle switching was added. Hence why it's not fixed in a very early version - the in-battle switching was only introduced in V016.

[ccexplore]

I found a few beneficial bugs in the meantime.  Due to their benefits to the player, I'm rather tempted to keep it all secret until I finish the game, but ultimately come to my senses and decide to mention them now in the same way that backroutes should not be kept secret from the level author.  I'll just finish the game without downloading any resulting updates (for now, unless there're new content). http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/devil.gif" alt=":evil:" title="Evil" class="smiley" /> http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

1) In-battle switching advances the character's status (eg. "Dark", "Silence") progression.  In other words, for statuses like "Dark" or "Silence" which are temporary and clear themselves after a few turns, you can simply in-battle switch the affected character back and forth a few times (~4-5 I think) and that would eventually result in the status removed, without losing the current turn at all (since you don't lose a turn by switching).  This effectively gives you a free way to cure those statuses.  Of course it doesn't work if the status is non-temporary.  Moreover, status like "poison" which regularly inflicts damage per turn, will inflict such damage during each in-battle switching as well.  I haven't tried "regen" status yet but I suspect it will likely behave similar, potentially giving you a free way to immediately and fully replenish your HP.

Of course, allies and monsters not involved in the switching are unaffected.

2) The stat boosts provided by Vince's special abilities (eg. Adrenaline, Meditate) will remain on the character post-battle (you can even see them in the menu screen outside of battle) if the character escaped during battle (either by "Escape" command or by Vince's "Flee" special ability).  On the other hand, if a character wasn't in battle when the battle ends (eg. you switched him out of battle, and then the battle ends by escape), he does lose those stat boosts he may have had during battle.  This is how I know one way or another, it is a bug and not intended.  The bottom line is that you can basically stat-boost up to 4 characters in your party before actually going into the next battle.  And yes, those boosts are saved (at least it look that way) when you save the game at a savepoint.

3) Arguable whether it is bug or just a sneaky trick intended for player to discover on their own, but because you can Escape from battle with an optional boss, if that optional boss has an item that can be stolen with Alicia's Theft ability, you can repeatedly steal and escape to get unlimited number of that item (until you defeat the boss of course or reach the max limit on number of items, or unless the boss is so quick and powerful, it kills your entire party after stealing without giving you any chance to escape).  In one sense, it's no different than the fact that you can do the same through random battles to accumulate such stolen items, so that's why I'm not convinced it should be called a bug.  On the other hand, the game (at the point I'm in so far, anyway) definitely depicts an optional boss as a singular character, unlike random battles where the monsters are presumably different members of the same species from battle to battle, and so it doesn't feel like you are stealing from the same entity with random battles.

[namida]

1) In-battle switching advances the character's status (eg. "Dark", "Silence") progression.  In other words, for statuses like "Dark" or "Silence" which are temporary and clear themselves after a few turns, you can simply in-battle switch the affected character back and forth a few times (~4-5 I think) and that would eventually result in the status removed, without losing the current turn at all (since you don't lose a turn by switching).  This effectively gives you a free way to cure those statuses.  Of course it doesn't work if the status is non-temporary.  Moreover, status like "poison" which regularly inflicts damage per turn, will inflict such damage during each in-battle switching as well.  I haven't tried "regen" status yet but I suspect it will likely behave similar, potentially giving you a free way to immediately and fully replenish your HP.

Of course, allies and monsters not involved in the switching are unaffected.

2) The stat boosts provided by Vince's special abilities (eg. Adrenaline, Meditate) will remain on the character post-battle (you can even see them in the menu screen outside of battle) if the character escaped during battle (either by "Escape" command or by Vince's "Flee" special ability).  On the other hand, if a character wasn't in battle when the battle ends (eg. you switched him out of battle, and then the battle ends by escape), he does lose those stat boosts he may have had during battle.  This is how I know one way or another, it is a bug and not intended.  The bottom line is that you can basically stat-boost up to 4 characters in your party before actually going into the next battle.  And yes, those boosts are saved (at least it look that way) when you save the game at a savepoint.

3) Arguable whether it is bug or just a sneaky trick intended for player to discover on their own, but because you can Escape from battle with an optional boss, if that optional boss has an item that can be stolen with Alicia's Theft ability, you can repeatedly steal and escape to get unlimited number of that item (until you defeat the boss of course or reach the max limit on number of items, or unless the boss is so quick and powerful, it kills your entire party after stealing without giving you any chance to escape).  In one sense, it's no different than the fact that you can do the same through random battles to accumulate such stolen items, so that's why I'm not convinced it should be called a bug.  On the other hand, the game (at the point I'm in so far, anyway) definitely depicts an optional boss as a singular character, unlike random battles where the monsters are presumably different members of the same species from battle to battle, and so it doesn't feel like you are stealing from the same entity with random battles.

1) Aware of it. Haven't fixed it yet, but it's known.
2) I've seen this happen on occasion, but never managed to link it to escaping (duh). Will look into a fix now that it's known.
3) I didn't exactly think of that, but it's not really a bug, more a case of intending mechanics working together in ways that weren't expected. There is one storyline boss where this is specifically averted (if you make a second attempt at fighting them, you get a far less useful steal item), but I never thought about it much for optionals. Still, there are only two which have really valuable steal items, one of which can't be escaped from.

Cerberus and Suzaku, the latter of which cannot be escaped from.

None of these are major enough to bother putting out a V017C update for (I generally reserve those for game-breaking bugs, sometimes with a few simple fixes added alongside them), they'll probably be fixed in V018, and that will add new content (all new number versions do). Probably quite a lot of it, too.

Where are you up to so far, by the way?

[ccexplore]

At the point after the graveyard visit in Corgent Temple, before returning to Saria.  I am of course taking full advantage of #3 in the meantime, as you may've guessed. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/winktounge.gif" alt=";P" title="Wink-Tongue" class="smiley" /> Regrettably while the item is useful, it doesn't sell well.

You praise the virtues of the battles, but actually I find the dungeon/puzzle designs to be just as good, and for me quite the highlight of playing the game (not that there's anything wrong with the battles, but I can usually get a similar effect in most RPGs by doing challenge-style plays like LLGs).  Granted, I haven't been playing RPGs for quite some time now so maybe the dungeon designs are not that unique or new compare with current games, but at least for me I find many of them clever, new and fun in your game so far. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/thumbsup.gif" alt=":thumbsup:" title="Thumbs Up" class="smiley" />

[namida]

Ah, you're two bosses away from DR and then DT then... =P Your taking advantage of #3 will help majorly against the latter; I find him impossible to beat at low levels without *some* form of Haste (whether it's the spell or items) for at least one or two characters.

Anyway, while as I said I'm not going to release a minor update to patch it, I've fixed the two escape-related bugs. Still got to fix the switching bug though (I had actually noticed this bug due to a slightly different effect of it - Poison/Regen damage will occur on switching. Same root cause.)

[Proxima]

I know this game hasn't been updated for a long time, but I'm working on an RPG Maker project, and I decided it would be a good learning experience to have another play through namida's game

Let's Play Curse of Saria!

[Dullstar]

@Proxima:

RPG Maker is always fun to use, but I'm soooo bad at actually finishing anything.

I haven't watched your playthrough, but if you're making your own project (I have no idea how much experience you have so you might already know this):

A tip: Either disable the ability to change the formation, or make sure to use it in testing. It's not unusual for people to forget that this option exists, and if you change the party leader, it can cause duplicate characters to appear in cutscenes (because many users will fail to take into account that the party leader can be any character within the party). It is fixable, but I don't quite remember exactly how to do it - it wasn't too complicated, though, and if you need this information I can look for a project where I made use of it.

Here's an example of this happening from one of my projects.

Spoiler

Also, when you have the project open in RPG Maker and launch it in the test mode, you can hold down control to pass through obstacles, which can be a nice time-saver. Before I realized this, I had several instances where I ended up getting stuck in places and wasn't sure why. Turns out I'd just bumped the control button.


This post is old, but it might still be useful information to someone:

Since you brought up Android and iOS on another thread, I'm curious whether any free RPG makers out there currently provide cross-platform support particularly with mobile platforms such as at least Android.  You may well reach a much larger user base if people can download and play the game on those platforms as well.

I don't know about free RPG Maker-type programs specifically, beyond the fact that at least one exists, but RPG Maker MV supports exporting to iOS and Android. I don't know if the support is any good, though.

[ccexplore]

Like many games I've played, at some point I apparently got distracted and never managed to finish even what partial content was available at the time, even though I clearly enjoyed playing it.

@Proxima: maybe you'll find it even more useful to see if namida may be willing to share to you some of the actual RPG Maker project files?  I imagine it'd be a little like looking at Lix's source code in addition to playing the game itself.