Lemmings 2 demo

[Leo]

Prob Lem. map in the middle (number 5) is not from Mega Drive.

[Leo]

There are some old skill icons in the full games.

On the PC version we can see some old stile icons in the level select screen (Parachuter and somewhat changed Laser Blaster).

http://i48.tinypic.com/2u9of0y.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

But in the game play, new icons are used.

http://i46.tinypic.com/24v5o48.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

Another example is FM Towns version, level select screen with some old stile icons.

http://i47.tinypic.com/v3dt2u.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

And the game play (FM Towns) also with some old stille icons.

http://i50.tinypic.com/xaxddv.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

More old stille icons (FM Towns) on the practice level (Climber and Builder). Also take a look on the Jet Pack (sprite, not icon). He has real flame instead of just dots on the other versions (or even nothing on the SNES).

http://i50.tinypic.com/2ppzchz.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

[ccexplore]

When we speaking about 'new' levels, there are some 'new' levels in the SNES and Megadrive/Grenesis versions. For example, the first 'Sports' level is completely different. Some levels are really new, and some are changed a little. Many SNES levels are different because there are no catapults and chains in the SNES version (some obstacles also missing, e.g. Walker in 'Space' tribe and hand from the dark in 'Cavelem'), and all cannons are fixed at the ground.
SNES version is also unique because there are background pictures on the levels and on the 'Polar' levels snow is falling.

Yeah, SNES version is quite different with the differences you noted.  I actually complained on one of the old forums that I felt the changes watered down that version of the game, although Mike Dailly was still around at the time and he said the changes were intentional and he thought was overall an improvement.  I guess my perspective came from having played the SNES version of L2 first before I got ahold of the PC and Amiga versions.

Hmm, come to think of it, since we have working L2 editors for the PC version, it would be feasible now to re-create the SNES levels for PC.  Although as I said, I didn't find any of the changes an improvement so I don't know if I would bother myself.

I haven't played the Megadrive/Genesis versions, not aware there are "new" levels in that version? http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/huh.gif" alt="???" title="Huh?" class="smiley" />

[Prob Lem]

Prob Lem. map in the middle (number 5) is not from Mega Drive.

Whoah, you're right, hah. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/laugh.gif" alt=":D" title="Laugh" class="smiley" /> You can guess that I never really looked at the map much!

I didn't know that any other version used that font, I must admit.

Anyway, I'd love to know about the above-mentioned "new" levels, too. I've never really played any of the other versions of Lemmings 2, so the Mega Drive levels are the only ones I know. Now I'm curious. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

[Mikex62]

I was able to find footage of the Amiga Demo from The Future Entertainment Show!  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/thumbsup.gif" alt=":thumbsup:" title="Thumbs Up" class="smiley" /> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnqbJj0Nv6U" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnqbJj0Nv6U
The differences are...

The Map screen is not animated. Also there are moved things.
The Level screens Lemmings are not dancing or whatever they are doing... they are standing motionless.
The Tribe images in the level screens are completely different!
The HUD hatch has glitched colors.
The Lemmings don't say "Yippee!" when they go into the exit.
Points are awarded at the end of the levels. This might be taking the side of the SNES version of Lemmings.  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/huh.gif" alt="???" title="Huh?" class="smiley" />
The User skill are available on every level but there are none of them to use  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/laugh.gif" alt=":D" title="Laugh" class="smiley" />
The Lemmings don't get stunned by the Bomber.
The Stomper is slower and stomps less of the ground?
Seen in the video, the hud color changes.
The Bomber has a different sound.
Lemmings that are stunned have no stars.
Bricks have no shading.

[Leo]

Prob Lem, do you know there are CD audio tracks on the FM Towns version? These songs are different from any other version.

It's hard to say what is 'new'. At least 2 Sports levels are 'new' on the Mega Drive/Genesis compared to computer versions, but they are not 'new' compared to SNES version. Sports tribe level 1 and 5 are completely different on the SNES and Mega Drive/Genesis compared to other versions.
Polar level 1 is different (not much) on the SNES.
Highland 3 on the Mega Drive/Genesis can't be solved as usual (look like some bug).
Egyptian 10 is the hardest to solve on Mega Drive/Genesis. It's the same as in computer versions (SNES version is slightly changed), but it's not possible to use more than one 'Glue Pourer' at once (like it is on computer versions). So, it's much complicated to solve this level on Mega Drive/Genesis, than on any other version. On the Amiga it's very easy because of some bug, can be solved with one 'Mortar' and two 'Glue Pourers' ('Mortar' explosion can blow a hole to the lower level).

Look at these differences on the Outdoor level between Mega Drive/Genesis and SNES.

http://i46.tinypic.com/301lytd.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />
http://i47.tinypic.com/krxbm.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

There are many small diferences between versions and some big differences (like 2 of the Sports levels). Some differences are not visualy significant, but solution can be much different.
I can't remember exactly all differences. There are 7 versions (not counting the Gameboy) and I can't check all of them now, 120x7=840 levels, it's to many.

I am playing all that versions now on the PC (Windows XP) with emulators and with full access to all levels. All can be played with a mouse (except the Gameboy version).
If anyone want's to play (or try to find what is different), I can upload somewhere any version with or without emulator. It's very hard to talk about that if no one other can compare for yourself.

[Leo]

Just checked, SNES 'Beach' level 6 is a 'new' one, completely different from the other versions. And 'Egyptyan' level 10 is easyest on the SNES version (just one Mortar is enough to complete level).

[Clam]

Interesting that we have 10 or so scrapped skills, and yet none looks like a sled or toboggan that could be the Sledger skill mentioned in the Lemmings Adventure Gamebook.

Some brief speculation on skills (topic needs m0ar of this):

• The one between axe and ladder looks to be disintegrating, rather than forming into something. Maybe a teleporter? Control it with two clicks like an archer, could have a limited range so it's not too powerful.
• Ladder could be a one-time climber, like the kayaker.
• I wonder if the sandcastle is actually the sand pourer (with a sandcastle shape, maybe considered too similar to planter). The one next to it looks like he's piecing together the pyramid (builder-like, with tiles) rather than pouring.
• The 'surfer' with sail could be a land-based equivalent of surfer, controlled by fan but stuck to the ground.

[ccexplore]

• The one between axe and ladder looks to be disintegrating, rather than forming into something.

Well, I saw it as a possible cuber since the stuff below the head looks kinda like a brick wall to me.  Disintegration?  Maybe, but looks too squarish and big to me.

• I wonder if the sandcastle is actually the sand pourer

It's quite possible that the glue pourer and sand pourer don't actually have equivalents in the demo version, especially considering that in contrast, the filler (the remaining "pouring"-type skill) is in both demo and final version.  I sorta try to make a connection between the demo and final-version skills but I have to agree it's debatable here.

At the moment, the ones that baffle me the most are: the fire one left of Icarus wings, the one above the jetpack that looks like he's trying to lift a heavy pole, and the one left of the roper that kinda looks like he's whipping a whip against a pole to lasso it?!? http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/huh.gif" alt="???" title="Huh?" class="smiley" />

[Prob Lem]

Prob Lem, do you know there are CD audio tracks on the FM Towns version? These songs are different from any other version.

No, I did not know that. I have zero familiarity with the FM Towns, though, outside of the FM Towns Marty's status as the first CD-ROM-based console. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" class="smiley" /> I'll have to look into this - I'm rather fond of all of the Lemmings soundtracks that I know, so I'd love to hear this one. Thanks for the heads-up!

As for the rest of your post, wow, I commend your attention to detail. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/laugh.gif" alt=":D" title="Laugh" class="smiley" /> Thanks very much for writing all of that up - it's very interesting stuff.

At the moment, the ones that baffle me the most are: the fire one left of Icarus wings, the one above the jetpack that looks like he's trying to lift a heavy pole, and the one left of the roper that kinda looks like he's whipping a whip against a pole to lasso it?!? http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/huh.gif" alt="???" title="Huh?" class="smiley" />

Be confused about the one with the pole no more. That, without a doubt, would have been a Highland skill - that lemming is lifting a http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caber_toss" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">caber. I have a Highland lemming pin that depicts this, even;

http://i.imgur.com/ky84YO1.jpg" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

I would guess that a lemming can't throw a caber very far, and that maybe it would have been used to bridge small gaps. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

As for the one to the left of the roper, it looks to me more like he's karate-chopping a barrier of some sort (it doesn't look like something is wrapped around it, to me, but instead like a comic book-esque impact/sound-effect marking), perhaps to destroy it.

Perhaps the one tending to a fire was intended to destroy parts of the scenery?

Incidentally, I wanted to comment on the one that you marked in red in your side-by-side comparison of the demo and final skill-sets - I believe you are correct with that. It appears that the one in the demo is holding a http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parafoil" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">parafoil, which at that resolution doesn't look particularly clear. I would guess that that's why they replaced it with a parachute. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" /> (Also, it looks to me like the Glue Pourer equivalent in the demo is using a caulk-gun...)

[ccexplore]

Oh cool on the caber toss skill.  Was that pin some sort of official game merchandise and how did you get (make?) it? http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/cool.gif" alt="8)" title="Cool" class="smiley" />

You're correct about the parafoil one.  Actually as Leo shown in one of his posts, in the PC final version the parafoil icon is still actually being used in the level select screen to depict the parachuter skill; the proper parachuter icon is only used in the skills toolbar within playing a level.  I thought the parafoil looked familiar even as I made the comparison screenshots, but since it wasn't in the 50-skills screenshot, I couldn't quite remember where I saw it at the time.

[Prob Lem]

Oh cool on the caber toss skill.  Was that pin some sort of official game merchandise and how did you get (make?) it? http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/cool.gif" alt="8)" title="Cool" class="smiley" />

It's official! In parts of Europe, the Amiga and MS-DOS versions of Lemmings 2 came with a random pin from a selection of twelve (one for each tribe, of course http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/laugh.gif" alt=":D" title="Laugh" class="smiley" />) in the box, and you could also order them from Psygnosis back in the day as well for a nominal fee plus postage. I got it from a chap from Germany, complete with the German MS-DOS version of the game, which also had the order form for other merchandise in it (specifically, t-shirts, hats, and mugs, though the hats weren't Lemmings-related), including the pins.

You're correct about the parafoil one.  Actually as Leo shown in one of his posts, in the PC final version the parafoil icon is still actually being used in the level select screen to depict the parachuter skill; the proper parachuter icon is only used in the skills toolbar within playing a level.  I thought the parafoil looked familiar even as I made the comparison screenshots, but since it wasn't in the 50-skills screenshot, I couldn't quite remember where I saw it at the time.

Wow, my eyeballs totally missed that, somehow. I have no idea why. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/undecided.gif" alt=":-\" title="Undecided" class="smiley" />

[Leo]

Pictures from Lemmings 2 pins are also in the game, on the level select screen. They are small and hard to see what actually Lemmings are doing on them. There are some differences between versions (e.g. Mega Drive/Genesis 'Space' is completely different). Here are all of them together (from the PC, I think).

http://i47.tinypic.com/if3ipe.png" alt="" class="bbc_img" />

[ccexplore]

Ah I see.  No wonder the pin also looks familiar to something in the game......

Actually, for the longest time I thought the Highland pin on the level selection screen is depicting a lemming playing a bagpipe or something. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/laugh.gif" alt=":D" title="Laugh" class="smiley" /> http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/undecided.gif" alt=":-\" title="Undecided" class="smiley" />  (Hey, when you don't know what a caber is but knows about bagpipe's association with Scotland......)  The actual wearable pin does make it pretty clear it's depicting the caber.

Looking at the pins (the in-game ones), I'm a little striked now at how many all of them are also depicting actual skills, especially when taking into account the demo-only ones:

Beach: attractor
Outdoor: the axe demo-skill
Egyptian: magic carpet
Medieval: archer
Classic: floater
Circus: hopper ? ? ? (possible exception to the rule)
Highland: caber tosser demo-skill
Polar: skater
Space:  okay, admittedly a slight stretch graphically, but could be that demo-skill above the caber that looks like surfboard with flames coming out the back end (which I imagine to be an air version of surfer, think hoverboard)
Cavelem: club basher
Shadow: bazooka
Sports: pole vaulter

[Prob Lem]

Pictures from Lemmings 2 pins are also in the game, on the level select screen. They are small and hard to see what is actually Lemmings doing on them. There are some differences between versions (e.g. Mega Drive/Genesis 'Space' is completely different). Here are all of them together (from the PC, I think).

Nicely spotted! http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/shocked.gif" alt=":o" title="Shocked" class="smiley" /> I totally never noticed that... (Though, admittedly, I learned of the pins themselves a bit more recently.)

To go with it, a picture of the complete set of the pins can be found http://www.lemmingsuniverse.net/items.html" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">here. In order, it shows;

Medieval; Circus; Cavelem; Space
Beach; Sports; Outdoor; Egyptian
Polar; Classic; Highland; Shadow

(It's worth noting that, whilst the skill used is the same, the Classic pin is not the same as http://i.imgur.com/jbQoLbO.png" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">the earliest Lemmings pin that was issued, though. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />)

Space:  okay, admittedly a slight stretch graphically, but could be that demo-skill above the caber that looks like surfboard with flames coming out the back end (which I imagine to be an air version of surfer, think hoverboard)

I don't actually think that that's a stretch at all, to be honest. Given the artwork, and the disclaimer text in the bottom-left corner on the back of the box for, at the very least, the Amiga version of Lemmings 2*, I'd say that it's probably pretty likely, myself. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />

*http://i.imgur.com/dmNgtmP.jpg" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">It says "Box images represent character skills within the game", and, if my memory on print lead-times back in those days serves me correctly, it could well have been finalised before the game was completed. (And people think that the "Not actual game footage" disclaimers on game ads these days are a new thing. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/tongue.gif" alt=":P" title="Tongue" class="smiley" />)