Suggestions for a new Cheapo Copycat game

[Essman]

-have the ability to choose whether each set is open access (play any level in the set even if the previous levels haven't been beaten) or restricted access (only play the later levels if earlier levels have been beaten)

Okay. Your computer will remember which levels you've beaten. And each level can have a password to access it without completing the levels before it. All of this will be an option for the level designer (they can allow full access, password access, or only allow access upon completion of the previous level).

-no replay glitches

The replay glitches weren't added on purpose. There won't be any glitches this time.

-have the ability to play .dat and .lvl (lemedit) files

I don't think so.

[Essman]

I don't know, really don't know, if it would be compatible on Cheapo... but if it is, it could be really hard to do. What do you think about that Peter?

I'm not even going to try. Might be too hard, and I only want to support my own level format.

Imagine you have to save all lemmings and then 1 lemming died. That way, you know that you failed the level. Why not putting a small window with this text inside when the game look that there's not enough lemming to complete the level:

"You failed the level! There's not enough lemmings to complete the level!"

Then, right under, put 2 buttons:

"Nuke them all and restart" + "Continue anyway"

Also, in the options of the game, turn on/off this window! What do you think about this?

Sounds good to me. Something like this probably won't get added in the first release, but I'll be adding features as time goes on, and this will be on the wish list.

[Proxima]

About the percentages thing: one obvious problem with using percentages is that some people's Cheapo levels have more than 100 lemmings.

One of my ResEdit levels for the Mac had 120 lemmings, to save 1, and so of course this displayed as "To Save 0%"!!!

....which puzzled people who saved zero lemmings, which is also 0%, and were told they'd failed the level.

- - -

Three more suggestions.

Firstly, I'd like it if the names of the game and editor programs weren't so similar! The number of times I've opened the wrong one........

Secondly, how about being able to nominate certain styles as "favourites"? This would make it much easier to choose a style when creating a level, as my Styles folder is jam-packed with ones I'm never going to use, but which I have to keep to play others' levels.

Thirdly, since we now have right-way-up and upside-down lemmings, why not up or down one-way wall?

[Essman]

Firstly, I'd like it if the names of the game and editor programs weren't so similar! The number of times I've opened the wrong one........

The way I have it now is that there is only one executable. From there you can choose some options and decide to edit levels or play the game.

Secondly, how about being able to nominate certain styles as "favourites"? This would make it much easier to choose a style when creating a level, as my Styles folder is jam-packed with ones I'm never going to use, but which I have to keep to play others' levels.

Good idea. I'll make a list of the 8 most recently used styles.

Thirdly, since we now have right-way-up and upside-down lemmings, why not up or down one-way wall?

Already done. Here is the dialog used for customizing the one-way arrows:

[Proxima]

whoa....... that's COOL............

(i'd prefer 10 most recently used styles not 8, as there are exactly 10 styles that i use, but it's your call)  B)

[guest]

I'm not even going to try. Might be too hard, and I only want to support my own level format.

Sounds good to me. Something like this probably won't get added in the first release, but I'll be adding features as time goes on, and this will be on the wish list.

Can you at least make your own level format publicly documented?

Incidentally, how similar or dissimilar is Cheapo compared with PC Lemmings on quantitative aspects of game mechanics?  (For example things like the maximum safe-fall distance.)

[guest]

Imagine you have to save all lemmings and then 1 lemming died. That way, you know that you failed the level. Why not putting a small window with this text inside when the game look that there's not enough lemming to complete the level:

"You failed the level! There's not enough lemmings to complete the level!"

Then, right under, put 2 buttons:

"Nuke them all and restart" + "Continue anyway"

Also, in the options of the game, turn on/off this window! What do you think about this?

For me personally I think it would be annoying as hell and I would turn it off right away, if it doesn't default to off already.

When I played on PC Lemmings, if I know I'd restart I wouldn't even bother nuking (yeah it's cool at first but after a while it gets boring), I'll just press ESC to get out and get back into the level as quickly as I can.  Or if I do want to practice on later parts of the level or what not I might choose to just go on.

Having that window popup would just get in the way.  Unless the window shows up in a very out of place location so that I can ignore it.

[Essman]

Can you at least make your own level format publicly documented?

It shouldn't really matter what the file format is, the level editor is able to edit the binary files. What I would rather do is make an SDK with public interfaces for editing sets and levels. Then you don't have to mess with the messy mess in the binary files. You can write some code. If there is something that someone wants to do that just cannot be done with the SDK and they really need the binary format, then I'll spend the time to type up some documentation. But that shouldn't happen since the level editor will be using the exact same SDK to make the levels in the first place.

Incidentally, how similar or dissimilar is Cheapo compared with PC Lemmings on quantitative aspects of game mechanics?  (For example things like the maximum safe-fall distance.)

It was all based on my observations while playing the game, which is not perfect, but close.

[guest]

It shouldn't really matter what the file format is, the level editor is able to edit the binary files. What I would rather do is make an SDK with public interfaces for editing sets and levels. Then you don't have to mess with the messy mess in the binary files.

Oh that would be even better, for everyone involved.  

[guest]

I must be having too many cups of coffee today, but here are some actual suggestions my mind concocted:

1) This is why I said I have too many cups of coffee:  I was thinking of having an animatable exit, such that when there are no more lemmings left to save and you have saved at least the minimum, some animation with the exit itself would play.  For example, the exit could look like a spaceship, and then when there are no more lemmings left to save and you saved at least the minimum, an animation will play where, say, the spaceship launches itself up and off the screen.  Or something like that.

Yeah okay this is frivilous.  Time to cut down on caffeine.  

2) I thought the idea in the Tribes where the total number you saved gets carried over to the next level is an interesting concept.  It might be useful to allow people to create a series of levels that does that.  Although I must admit I haven't worked out how this will work in conjunction with the original where you need to save minimum numbers on each level.

[guest]

Actually, let's not complicate ourselves.  Keep the two systems separate.  Instead, since we already planned to allow a levelset to be either just a set or an actual series (where the levels need to be completed sequentially), simply allow, for series, the option for the level designer to do Lemmings 1 vs. Lemmings 2-style scoring.

Lemmings 1 style scoring would mean each level has its own total-out and number-to-save.

Lemmings 2 style scoring would mean for the entire series, there is 1 total-out number, and a number of different number-to-saves that defines your level of success on the series.  Scoring would then apply only to the entire series.

Just a thought.

[guest]

While we are on the subject of series, it would be nice if the level designer could specify, for a levelset that behaves as a series, to specify (ie. can customize) some intro and possibly ending screens.  The screens would be just a series of bitmaps.

When you select to play a series for the first time, after you select the only level available at that point (the first), you will see the intro slides, and then the game goes into the first level.  After that, you won't ever see the intro slides again unless the user explicitly request so (say, a button at the level selection screen).

And of course the ending slides would be displayed when you have completed the series for the first time.  Or maybe every time you finishes the last level.

The real reason I'm talking about this is actually related to the lemmings 1/lemmings 2 scoring option.  Having customizable intro screens potentially allow the level designer to communicate this kind of information with a creative/artistic flair instead of merely having a fixed, program-defined line of text saying "this series uses lemmings 2 scoring" or worse, forcing the player to open up the levelset in the editor to find out how scoring works for that series.

[Essman]

Thanks for the suggestions "guest". I have all suggestions written down in a list and I'll probably get them all done eventually, just not for the beta releases.

[Mr. K]

This looks great so far!!

Just one suggestion: Don't make the title screen odd like in Cheapo.

[DragonsLover]

Hey Peter, nice screenshot!  

Can you show more please? That way, it would be great to see what the game will look! If you won't, that's ok then!

Also, I see that you'll have a website soon?