Cheapo Level Pak topic

[guest]

Well, there are two ways you can go about solving the level, an intended way and an unintended way.

The unintended way is basically just applying various delay tactics to lemmings 2-5 using the skillls you're given that doesn't go towards building to the exit, and stretching the build towards the exit to minimize time.

The intended way:

(hint)

Look at the pillar with all those cracks.  There are 2 cracks on the right side.  To trap the crowd you want them to go onto the upper crack since they can't proceed further left on that crack.  And remember you have all those climbers and floaters for diversionary purposes.

(solution: copy gibberish below and change the font)

Let lemmings 3-5 be athletes.  After the 1st and 2nd lemming turned around at the right pillar and approach the cracked pillar, have the 1st start building towards the cracked pillar when he's closed enough.  You want the build to go above the lower crack so that the crowd will be led to the upper crack instead and be trapped.  The 2nd lemming will head past the 1st while the building is still in progress, and so will follow the lower crack past the cracked pillar, and will build 3 times to reach the exit.  Release the crowd by mining from the upper crack when ready.

[guest]

It just occurred to me that a very handy way to read my Wingding-ed text is just to hit the "quote" link as if to reply to the message, then read the quoted message placed into the "Message" textbox in "post Reply".  B)

[Shvegait]

Oh, so I beat that level the unintended way after all? I figured it was intended because it just barely works!

[Conway]

Hints guy to the rescue . . . ! B)

  Anyway, yeah. Only the left-hand exit is accessible. Oh, and notice the groves in the pillar in the under the trap door?

  This is what I did:

  Lem1 mine where he lands. Lems 2-4 will walk past him, but lem5 will turn. Make lems 1-4 athletes. Then make lem5 build to the exit to the left.

[Shvegait]

Yeah, I used Conway's solution exactly.

[Proxima]

ok, solved it..... looked at guest's solution afterwards, turned out to be the same as mine except i'd reversed the roles of lemmings 1 and 2.

i had noticed the cracks in the pillar before..... the reason it took so long was that, for some reason, i'm very bad at thinking of solutions that go outside the main playing area. insane steve's "The First of Many", for instance, took me ages....... and on this one it just never occurred to me to climb up that pillar. shameful, i know. thanks for the help, guys.

EDIT: ok, what's up with level 22? i got 100% really easily but the level requires less. backroute?

[guest]

I've uploaded the version with a closer spike.

I've left your level (and Cheapo in general) aside for about a week.  But now that I took another stab at it I just realized that the closer right spike isn't quite enough, because it's possible to arrange for it to be bashed almost completely away from its left side.  So in addition, I think you need to make the spike completely straight, instead of the way it is right now where the left side of the right spike is only steeply sloped.

[chaos_defrost]

I've left your level (and Cheapo in general) aside for about a week. &#A0;But now that I took another stab at it I just realized that the closer right spike isn't quite enough, because it's possible to arrange for it to be bashed almost completely away from its left side. &#A0;So in addition, I think you need to make the spike completely straight, instead of the way it is right now where the left side of the right spike is only steeply sloped.

I have an idea as to your route -- I'm reasonably sure adding arrows so that the left spike can only be bashed to the right, and the right spike only to the left may work out for a solution. Thanks once again.

[guest]

I took a stab at working out a completely different solution to the mon0lith than what I have been doing so far.

This resulted in a solution that, on my particular run, saved 31 out of 40.  The maximum possible is 35 out of 40 but might or might not be doable depending on time.  On my 31/40 run, 31 is achieved at the moment when the clock just changed from 3 to 2 seconds.

This is probably not the intended solution because:

1) I still have 2 bashers left.
2) It makes use of what Steve calls "collision timing".
3) Moving the right spike further left will probably interfere with the solution (assuming also the change to make the right spike bash-to-the-left-only).

In this solution what remains of "THE MON0LITH" is "T MON0LI".

[chaos_defrost]

It may be possible to beat the level with maybe one or two bashers left using my idea, although there is no collision timing required. My solution also demolishes almost all of the text.

As it stands, though, my solution is faster than your solution. Do you think you can beat it with maybe 8-10 seconds left in this manner?

[guest]

As it stands, though, my solution is faster than your solution. Do you think you can beat it with maybe 8-10 seconds left in this manner?

Well, I made some adaptation to my collision-timing solution.  Boy, will you be pissed:

1) I have arranged things so that I can now just dig away the right pillar.

2) I am able to save 34/40 with 11 seconds left.

3) I have 4 bashers left.

That being said, the adaptation introduces more timing (in addition to the collision-timing already used) to the solution, so my unintended solution is probably harder to execute than whatever your intended solution is.

You can prevent this solution by moving the left pillar more to the right, but unfortunately for you, you said your intended solution requires it to be where it is now.

[chaos_defrost]

My intended solution really requires little or no timing... I'll just tell you it in an E-mail [Although I will leave a warning or something of the like if you don't wish to see it]. If it really is that hard to execute your newest route, I may just leave it in.

[guest]

It just occurred to me if you really want to, you might be able to prevent my solution by introducing a second pillar to the right.

I'm probably going to refrain from looking at your solution at this point.  I'm quite intrigued that it doesn't require timing and yet needs to use all those bashers.  Especially odd is how one would stop the bashers from bashing all the way through without wasting builders, and if that doesn't matter, how to steer the crowd up to the top.

[chaos_defrost]

I already sent it. Just ignore the E-mail for now.

The big trick is, indeed, how you steer the group up to the top of the structure. You need, if my math is right, at least 8 of the bashers, but more likely 10. A second pillar ruins the symmetry, but I can fix that. I'll see what else I can think of. I'm still working on other levels -- I want to have these sets out by March-ish.

[guest]

Alright, what the hell.  I'll e-mail you my solution so you can have a better idea of what to do with it.

Incidentally, every time I announce a solution to someone's level here, I almost always make screenshots of the solution beforehand.  So if you are curious about some of the earlier solutions that are currently obsolete, I can e-mail you those too.