Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge

Started by namida, August 28, 2009, 09:39:59 AM

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ccexplore

Frost 6 done with 5 skills rather than 6 as everyone has assumed all along, thanks to a rather straightforward solution found as part of this challenge.  (See http://www.lemmingsforums.com/index.php?topic=654.msg14471#msg14471" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">this post for attached replay.)

Minim

Thanks to Proxima for labelling this challenge incomplete. I have filled in some of the slots, but some of them I'm sure will be improvable.

Here's what I've got for Mayhem, Crazy and Wild:

Mayhem
5 & 23: 18
7: 14
8: 9
17: 12
19: 13
22 & 25: 16
30: 38

Crazy
8 & 20: 13
12 & 19: 8
13: 5
18: 6

Wild
2: 12
3, 14, 15 & 19: 10

I also did Wicked 6 in 12 skills and Wicked 8 in 9 skills.
Level Solving Contest creator. Anybody bored and looking for a different challenge? Try these levels!

Neolemmix: #1 #4 #5 #6
Lix: #2  #7
Both Engines: #3

Proxima

Thank you!  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/thumbsup.gif" alt=":thumbsup:" title="Thumbs Up" class="smiley" />

Do you have a replay for Wicked 6?

Minim

Oh sorry, but I don't. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/embarrassed.gif" alt=":-[" title="Embarrassed" class="smiley" /> This one might need to be checked in case the blockers need to be used (Which is highly doubtful as you need 100% for this challenge anyway). LemSteven made a proof that initially came from http://www.lemmingsforums.com/index.php?topic=562.msg13218#msg13218" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">these http://www.lemmingsforums.com/index.php?topic=562.msg14057#msg14057" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">posts. I haven't seen a replay about this at all, and couldn't do this myself. If someone would do a replay, that would be useful.

Anyway, I'm still clearing up, and found out a couple more results:

Wicked
13: 19
15: 20
18: 12

Havoc
1: 14
8: 10
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Neolemmix: #1 #4 #5 #6
Lix: #2  #7
Both Engines: #3

Minim

OK, some more results today to close out ONML and Christmas Lemmings

Wicked 11: 11 skills (See LemSteven's post http://www.lemmingsforums.com/index.php?topic=562.msg14034#msg14034" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">here.)
Havoc 18: 15 skills
Frost 7: 13 skills

Xmas 91
1: 9
2: 11
Level Solving Contest creator. Anybody bored and looking for a different challenge? Try these levels!

Neolemmix: #1 #4 #5 #6
Lix: #2  #7
Both Engines: #3

Minim

And finally, the Original Lemmings levels:

Taxing 17: 9
Mayhem 14: 18
Mayhem 15: 14
Mayhem 18: 20

All done! Although I really didn't want to triple post. http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/angry.gif" alt=">:(" title="Angry" class="smiley" />
Level Solving Contest creator. Anybody bored and looking for a different challenge? Try these levels!

Neolemmix: #1 #4 #5 #6
Lix: #2  #7
Both Engines: #3

LemSteven

#66
My 1-climber solution to Havoc 7 for the "What are the skills you need for maximum %" thread also improves the result here, so that level is now down to 20 skills.

Edit 11 Jun 2018: Down to 19 skills.  I originally thought I needed a floater get the left group spaced out properly, but I found a way to avoid it:
Spoiler
1: Set the release rate to 80.  After the second lemming enters the level, raise it to 99.
2: Make the first lemming from the left hatch a digger just before the pillar.  The second lemming from the left group should be a climber.
3: Go to the right hatch and make a lemming build several pixels before the edge.
4: Immediately return to the left group.  One lemming should be climbing the next pillar, and the next one should be about to hit it.  Make the latter a miner at the last possible moment before he turns.  The climber should drop into his tunnel, facing right.
5: Quickly go back to the right group and place a blocker on the first builder brick.  He must be freed by a single basher later on.
6: Back on the left side, all of the lemmings except the miner will drop onto a ledge with a pillar to their right (the last one will barely make it before the miner cuts off access to this ledge).  Make the first of these a blocker at the far left edge.
7: Complete the rest of the route normally, using a basher, miner, and 3 builders on the left, and 6 additional builders on the right.
8: Release the left crowd by making a lemming dig the instant he turns off the blocker (he needs to free the blocker).
9: Release the right group by bashing away a piece of the step the blocker is standing on.

ccexplore

Tricky 22 improved to 10 skills thanks to MASTER-88's superior record for that level on SNES, which also works on DOS (Lemmix replay attached).

ccexplore

Tricky 5 improved to 7 skills thanks to MASTER-88's discovery on how to get through the final ball using only one basher.  This is otherwise same solution as the 8 skills one.

ccexplore

Taxing 8 (repeat of Tricky 5) also improved to 8 skills for exact same reason as above.  I just forgot to test that level earlier today.  It's probably the same solution now as MASTER-88's, minus the fact that SNES needs 3 rather than 2 builders to reach the island before the exit.

ccexplore

Taxing 17 improved to 6 skills.  I'm just glad it didn't take tons more tries to get something that works out, it wasn't clear at all whether it's really possible to not do crowd control on this level, but luckily I got it working.

Not really feeling motivated to try to adapt this to SNES.  All the details have to change because the miner on SNES stops mining earlier relative to the steel block (it has better steel detection for the miner).  So right off the bat even the correct release rate number to use will change, and if the initial width of the crowd walking area doesn't end up dividing evenly (it's great that on DOS, you can end up with a width of 150, resulting in a cycle of 300 nicely divisible by 25, which maps to RR 56 or 57), you might even have to do the annoying per-lemming tweaking of release rate to get things to work out.  Plus the SNES miner itself moves a little different, so finding the right place to start mining will also differ.  It's even entirely plausible that you might run out of time thanks to that version's faster timer.

LemSteven

#71
Mayhem 17 with 11 skills confirmed in DOS.  It's embarrassingly simple, to the point that I'm amazed nobody found this 10 years ago.

Hint:
Use the regular "stepping stones" solution (using 9 builders), but place the blocker on the first builder brick.  That way he can be released with a single basher.



Mayhem 18 with 18 skills is also confirmed in DOS - 8 skills for the right half, and 10 skills for the left.  There is a small offset in the terrain that allows a lemming from the top right group to perform the tasks for the bottom right group, thereby saving a climber (along with another skill usage later on to prevent said climber from climbing off the right side of the level).  See attached screenshots for details.

Note that this is a 13 builder solution, which also improves the result for "What skills do you need for 100%".

LemSteven

#72
Mayhem 22 with 14 skills is confirmed in DOS.  There's lots of pixel-precise builder assignments in this one, but fortunately they all occur early in the level.  Screenshots are attached, even though I'm pretty sure this is largely identical to MASTER-88's SNES solution (I haven't viewed his videos; I'm attempting to solve these on my own).

MASTER-88

QuoteI'm pretty sure this is largely identical to MASTER-88's SNES solution (I haven't viewed his videos; I'm attempting to solve these on my own).

My solution use little bit different builiding route and skills, but you really figured out those builders into ground. Congrats.:)
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LemSteven

#74
I finally confirmed Mayhem 23 with 16 skills in DOS.  It was nothing intuitive or obvious, and I'm wondering if I'm missing something substantially easier.  Anyway, here's the solution.

Solution
1: After the first two lemmings come out, set the release rate to 88.
2: Make the first lemming a builder at the far right of the initial holding cell.  This should allow him to scale the wall and walk up the slope on the right.
3: The second lemming blocks at a pixel-precise location as soon as he steps off of the level ground, such that he can be released with a single basher later on.
4: The leader builds 5x to reach the wall on the left, about 3/4 of the way up.
5: Release the blocker using a single basher.
6: When the crowd gets to the top of the bridge, there is a sliding-glitch-friendly spot on the wall where a builder can force one of the lemmings behind him to slide up to (almost) the top of the wall. 
7: Make the lemming that slid up the wall a basher as soon as he stops sliding.
8: Make the basher/leader a floater.
9: When the leader finishes bashing and drops down, build 3x to the right to build a catch bridge for the others.
10: The crowd bashes through the large wall.
11: Make the leader bash through the ball under the trap.



Mayhem 25 with 13 skills is also confirmed in DOS.  It's pretty straightforward, except for the use of a steel glitch in the beginning.

Solution
1: Make the first lemming build at the very edge of the block, and then dig after he lays his first brick.
2: The second lemming builds just before he reaches the edge of the digger's hole.
3: The third lemming takes one step and then builds.  Make him block after he lays his first brick.
4: Set the release rate to 19.
5: Make the digger build before he runs out of terrain to dig through.  He will then make a path to the exit using 5 additional builders (this should be pretty straightforward).
6: Mine through the bridge restraining the crowd, about halfway up.
7: Make a lemming coming out of the hatch bash through the builder brick the blocker is standing on.



Taxing 20 is down to 7 skills in DOS, beating the SNES record by 1.  The critical point is right at the beginning, where the first obstacle can be cleared with just a digger and a builder, while leaving enough terrain in place to block left-facing lemmings.  This allows the right side to be completed with just 2 bashers.  See attached screenshots.