Lemmings Plus DOS Project (third and final demo now available!)

[namida]

EDIT: Renamed it "Project" rather than "Remake" since it's turning out to be mostly original levels, with a few remakes of Lemmings Plus classics.

Number of levels completed so far, as well as how many are original, repeat, or unique. The difference between "original" and "unique" is that those classed as original have a repeat version of them later on, those classed as unique do not.

Mild: 30 of 30 completed (22 original, 0 repeat, 8 unique)
Wimpy: 30 of 30 completed (21 original, 4 repeat, 5 unique)
Medi: 30 of 30 completed (9 original, 12 repeat, 9 unique)
Danger: 30 of 30 completed (2 original, 19 repeat, 9 unique)
PSYCHO: 30 of 30 completed (0 original, 23 repeat, 7 unique)
Total: 150 of 150 levels completed (54 original, 58 repeat, 38 unique)

Attached file is the official 10 level demo, containing 2 levels from each difficulty rating.
Mild: "Heading On In" and "Up, Down, Round & Round!"
Wimpy: "Life, The Universe & Everything" and "One Step At A Time"
Medi: "The Long Road To Lemming High" and "Die The Death Of The Damned"
Danger: "The Buildo Station" and "Bullet Lemming"
PSYCHO: "Coalburner" and "No Salvation"

Modifications: "Up, Down, Round & Round" has been moved to Wimpy. "Die The Death Of The Damned" has been moved to Danger. "Bullet Lemming" has been moved to PSYCHO and has one fewer builder.

Now attached: A second 10 level demo. It also contains 2 levels from each difficulty.
Mild: "Farewell, My Lemming" and "Across The Ditch"
Wimpy: "Backdraft" and "Get up, up, up!"
Medi: "This Is..." and "Eye of the Lemming"
Danger: "In the life of a Lemming" and "So That's The Plan..."
PSYCHO: "Lightspeed Lemming" and "No Time To Die"

Modifications: "Backdraft" moved to Danger and no longer has a builder, plus numerous backroute fixes (since terrain changes are involved, a modified LVL file is attached). "Eye of the Lemming" now has 10 lemmings instead of 2 (still requires 100%).

Third (and absolute final!) demo now available. Again, two levels from each difficulty.
Mild: "The Graveyard" and "You Just Lost The Game!!!"
Wimpy: "Just For Fun" and "Only One Place To Go!"
Medi: "Bob's Mistake" and "Take A Dive"
Danger: "Circular Wavelength" and "The Hideout"
PSYCHO: "Not gonna work." and "A Perfect Nightmare"

Modifications: None yet.

You can also download all 3 demos in a single Lemmix player. Link: http://rapidshare.com/files/307219411/LPDOSDemo.zip" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">http://rapidshare.com/files/307219411/LPDOSDemo.zip
This player also has the orders changed to reflect reorderings for the final release, and has the updated versions of Bullet Lemming, Eye of the Lemming and Backdraft. It also contains all of ccexplore's updates.

These hints are updated to reflect any fixes or changes made after the releases of the demos.

First Demo
Heading On In - This level is quite straightforward and should not require a hint.
Up, Down, Round & Round! - Take care not to create any fatal drops, and you'll be fine.
Life, The Unverse & Everything - This level is quite straightforward and should not require a hint.
One Step At A Time - As the title suggests, just deal with each obstacle individually as you come to it.
The Long Road To Lemming High - You may need to go outside the playing area in order to create a path (although it is possible without doing so).
Die The Death Of The Damned - You have no spare skills, so you'll have to find a method of crowd control that doesn't use skills. Think of what else you have that can control lemmings to some degree.
The Buildo Station - Set the Release Rate to about 80, and you should have no problem.
Bullet Lemming - At one point, you need to turn the worker around, but you can't do this without running out of builders. Is there a way that you can turn a lemming around with a builder you need to use anyway?
Coalburner - Don't assume terrain is purely for decoration just because it looks like it is.
No Salvation - Place your skills very carefully in order to create a path up the staircase. The other parts of the levels are purely distractions.

Second Demo
Farewell, My Lemming - Block off the left side, and it's easy from there.
Across The Ditch - This level shouldn't need a hint.
Backdraft - The easy part is working out how to turn a climber around, the hard part being how to get the crowd out of this turn-around.
Get up, up, up! - The tight space of this level shouldn't matter much.
This Is... - Most parts of the level are unused.
Eye of the Lemming - Instead of trying to stop the crowd from getting stuck, try to release them from where they get stuck.
In the life of a Lemming - The flag-like structures are most certianly not just for decoration.
So That's The Plan... - Blockbomb your way past the flamethrower, and it's smooth sailing from there.
Lightspeed Lemming - If a basher has two other bashers in front of him, he'll start walking again and overtake both.
No Time To Die - Use different lemmings to make different parts of the path at the same time.

Third Demo
The Graveyard - This level is quite straightforward and should not require a hint.
You Just Lost The Game - There's quite a few ways to approach this one, just choose a path and solve it, they're all pretty simple.
Just For Fun - This level is quite straightforward and should not require a hint.
Only One Place To Go - For the most part, you should try to solve the level backwards.
Bob's Mistake - You must go the wrong way first.
Take A Dive - There is a way to get lower, think carefully about what it may be.
Circular Wavelength - Send two lemmings over the top, and have one more mine down. Once you do this, the rest isn't too hard.
The Hideout - Your worker should come from the right side, but the first thing he should do is save the left.
Not gonna work. - The 20th floater is used on a lemming before it falls off the starting area, but it's not the 20th lemming.
A Perfect Nightmare - You need to do something a bit unordinary to contain the lemmings, as any ordinary trick will fail.

Minimum Skills records for each level
1st Demo
01 - 1 skill (namida)
02 - 17 skills (namida)
03 - 14 skills  (namida)
04 - 14 skills (namida)
05 - 13 skills (namida)
06 - 7 skills (The level is very obviously not beatable with fewer than this)
07 - 24 skills (namida)
08 - 16 skills (ccexplore) [This is based off the old 12-builder version of the level AFAIK]
09 - 23 skills (namida)
10 - 8 skills (namida)

2nd Demo
01 - 6 skills (namida)
02 - 4 skills (namida)
03 - 9 skills (namida) [This is based off the fixed, no-builder version of the level]
04 - 8 skills (namida)
05 - 9 skills (namida)
06 - 5 skills (namida) [This is based off the fixed, 10-lemming version of the level]
07 - 16 skills (namida)
08 - 14 skills (namida)
09 - 32 skills (namida)
10 - 19 skills (geoo)

3rd Demo
01 - 3 skills (namida)
02 - 8 skills (namida)
03 - 4 skills (namida)
04 - 3 skills (namida)
05 - 6 skills (namida)
06 - 8 skills (namida)
07 - 12 skills (namida)
08 - 8 skills (namida)
09 - 41 skills (namida)
10 - 18 skills (namida)


I've also now uploaded a spreadsheet that contains a full level list (with gaps on levels not yet made, of course), as well as:
- Which style each level uses
- Whether the level is original, repeat or unique
- If applicable, where the repeats/earlier versions are
- Maximum possible %
- Minimum skills to complete
- Minimum skills to acheive maximum %
- Whether or not the level is possible in the following challenges: Single skill type, 1 minute, Release Rate 99, one skill per lemming, one lemming performing skills only



Due to 4-attachment-per-post limit, the third demo is attached to a message just below.

[Dullstar]

I have uploaded ccexplore's lemmings DOS exe hack to the file portal, which is basically an upscaled Custom Lemmings.  I don't know exactly how many levels are in the Plus Packs, though...

[namida]

Yeah, I saw that. LP1 has 75 (three ranks of 17 and two of 12), LP2 has 60 (four ranks of 15) and LP3 has 80 (four ranks of 20), for a total of 215 levels. (Some of which, however, would be removed or replaced for reasons mentioned above.)

Third demo is attached to this post due to 4-per-post limitation.

[Dullstar]

Mathematics do a lot, don't they?

Okay, so for the 120 slots in the original game, that leaves 95 slots...

Now if you based it on ONML, you'd have 2 games of 100 and 15 that would be removed.

Are there at least 15 candidates for removal?  It would make ONML add up right, and the adlib.dat files for OhNo! and Original Lemmings may be swappable.

[namida]

The following levels will require either removal, replacement, or a large degree of modification (minor modification isn't included in this list):

LP1 (22 levels total)
Funny
2) In The Long Walk - Beach graphics set
http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/cool.gif" alt="8)" title="Cool" class="smiley" /> Sega Six - Custom graphics set
11) LEMMING INSANITY! - Special graphics
16) The Commander Keen Level - Special graphics

Strange
5) Lemmdows 2000 Professional - Special graphics, vertical scrolling
7) Let's Play Triple Triad - Special graphics, vertical scrolling
12) The Weapon Room - Beach graphic set
15) We All Fall Up - Upside down

Weird
3) Lemmings In The War - Custom graphic set
9) A Holiday In Hell - Beach graphic set
12) The Writing On The Wall - Special graphics
13) Sega Seven - Custom graphic set
15) Sega Eight - Custom graphic set
16) Poor Wee Creatures War Remix - Custom graphic set

Wacky
1) 9R33N L3MM1N95 - Special graphics
12) We All Fall Up XP - Upside down

Insane
1) Get in your car, and drive up the wall - Special graphics
2) Are You Keen? - Special graphics
3) Lemmdows 2000 Server - Special graphics, vertical scrolling
4) Card Time - Special graphics, vertical scrolling
http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/cool.gif" alt="8)" title="Cool" class="smiley" /> This Is Not A Test - Special graphics
9) Yeah Lemma! - Special graphics

LP2 (13 levels total)
Light
15) Indirect Route - Vertical scrolling

Neutral
5) Confusion - Vertical scrolling
10) Just Go Up - Custom graphic set

Dark
2) Quick Clicks - Release rate is above 99
4) Just Get Your Lemmings There! - Beach graphic set
10) Goin' For It - Custom graphic set
11) The Ghost Floor - Cheapo mechanics
13) Oblivion - Cheapo-exclusive terrain pieces are vital to the design
15) Temple of Oblivion - Cheapo-exclusive terrain pieces are vital to the design

Evil
http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/cool.gif" alt="8)" title="Cool" class="smiley" /> A Miner Problem - Cheapo mechanics
9) Castle of Oblivion - Cheapo-exclusive terrain pieces are vital to the design
11) Race of Insanity - Custom graphic set
13) Quick Clicks II - Release rate above 99

LP3 (13 levels total)
Daigoro
http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/cool.gif" alt="8)" title="Cool" class="smiley" /> Forever Seven - Cheapo mechanics (although they're not essential, but the lack of them would be a huge annoyance in DOS)
15) Lane of Lament - Cheapo-exclusive terrain pieces are vital to the design

Kozuka
5) Sunrise - Special graphics
7) Lane of Lament - Cheapo-exclusive terrain pieces are vital to the design

Wakizashi
http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/cool.gif" alt="8)" title="Cool" class="smiley" /> Sunrise II - Special graphics
9) Lane of Lament - Cheapo-exclusive terrain pieces are vital to the design
19) Copyright Infringement Part 1 - Possibly too wide

Zanmato
1) Lane of Lament - Cheapo-exclusive terrain pieces are vital to the design
4) Copyright Infringement Part 2 - Possibly too wide
6) Sunset - Special graphics
http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/cool.gif" alt="8)" title="Cool" class="smiley" /> Impulse of Light - Cheapo mechanics
9) The Way Across - Cheapo mechanics
11) Down The Middle We Go! - Vertical scrolling

That's a total of 38. However, some of them (Oblivion is the first one to come to mind) could be reconstructed in DOS using alternative but similarly-functioning designs, or possibly even different graphic sets that do have the required pieces. Should this be done by combining the packs, the Lane of Laments would be likely candidates for removal due to the terrain similarity (and in one of them, solution similarity) to Oblivion.

[Dullstar]

ONML should do the trick then for a base...

Although it would be interesting to see the return of Lemmdows 2000 professional by doing a VGASPEC...  but that probably wouldn't work right.  Besides, it would ahve to be completely redone.

[namida]

While that level itself can't be remade, a similar styled level could.

In reality, exact copies would be too much effort. Instead, I'm redoing them so that the basic theme of the level is the same, the general look is the same, and where possible any major tricks are still required, but the level itself may have some differences.

For example, compare the attached image of the Cheapo version of "To The End!" to a DOS remake I did just now. In both versions, you're required to save 30 of 30, you have 6 minutes, release rate is 1, and you're given 20 of every skill except builders (of which you have none).

(Note that the one-way wall is still one-way in the Cheapo version, this just doesn't show up in the editor. In fact, in Cheapo, it has BOTH direction one way walls, meaning the only way to destroy it is bombers or diggers. Obviously, two overlapping one way objects won't work in the DOS version. However, the exact placement of the steel areas, combined with lack of builders, prevents you from bashing or mining through it in the DOS version anyway.)

[Dullstar]

You did a pretty good job there, though the stairs could be improved in DOS, quite possibly easily.

[namida]

Probably, but the solution remains exactly the same, so there's no real need to be picky. (Actually, there is one new element to the solution, albeit a very minor one, which wasn't intentional but I think I'll keep anyway.)

[Proxima]

So, if you're removing 48 levels from 215, that leaves 167... I would suggest you also remove some of the less interesting levels to leave a nice round 120. For instance, doesn't one of the LPs begin with skill training levels that could simply be snipped out?

(Also, does DOS Lemmings support the horizontally flipped trapdoors available in Cheapo?)

[Dullstar]

That can also work.  It is also possible to make fresh levels.

[namida]

Yeah. I would get rid of the annoying levels (overly focused on building, etc), the training levels, and those which are incompatible (except Oblivion, as I definately want to at least try to get it working in DOS, it's one of my best tricks ever, however, most likely Temple of Oblivion, Castle of Oblivion and Dungeon of Oblivion would be left out as they just re-use the same trick while throwing in normal level surroundings).

And no, DOS doesn't support such doors, although it's not hard to emulate. (Place terrain exactly where they come out that'd turn them around and cover it with a steel area, of course, that does leave potential for builder glitches, but I don't think many LP levels use the flipped entrances anyway)

[Proxima]

Hmm. One level that does use reversed trapdoors -- and where that fix wouldn't be enough -- is Interlocked in LP3, a level that I particularly hope can be kept as it's one of a few where I managed to save 100% even though the document that comes with LP3 says it's impossible  http://www.lemmingsforums.com/Smileys/lemmings/smiley.gif" alt=":)" title="Smiley" class="smiley" />

[namida]

Why wouldn't it be enough? At worst, wouldn't the positions just have to be modified slightly to accomodate for it?

[ccexplore]

The last one is the special graphics levels. The original lemmings, for music reasons, would most likely crash with more than 4 of these.

I'm not 100% sure that's the case.  I think you might just get no music, although I suppose that's only a tiny bit more desirable than crashing.

There's also still the fact that the musics totally wouldn't suit - but maybe cc or someone else knows how to insert custom music? (All the LP1 special graphics levels use the same unique music as each other, while LP3 ones just use the normal music, if that's any help.)

I do have the technical knowledge to do so, although I don't know how successful I will be at converting the MIDI custom music into something of acceptable quality in the more restrictive realm of Adlib music of DOS Lemmings.  Do you have an upload of the MIDI file somewhere?  Regardless, it'll take a bit of work and I'm not sure I really have the time and will to do all that.

Anyway, if we're already thinking of customizing parts of DOS Lemmings (eg. custom music), I might be able to do further customizations into total number of levels supported by the game, or possibly even a way to create reverse trapdoors (the latter is probably a bit of wishful thinking, but theoretically possible).  Changing the total number of levels supported by the game might actually be the easiest of all the customizations.