[DISC.][PLAYER] UI and talismans

[Proxima]

At the moment, there are a few issues with the user interface for informing players about talismans:

Multiple talismans on one level are not easily discoverable.
The game doesn't display the requirements of a talisman you've previously beaten. (You may want to check these when writing a review of the level, or posting a challenge for the level.) It's true that you can check via the F4 list of all talismans for the pack, but this is a little awkward, and a quick way of checking while in the level itself would be welcome.
The preview screen layout leaves space for a talisman, whether or not there is one. (I don't have an issue with this, but Strato found it ugly.) However, the preview screen can only show one talisman, and it doesn't cope well with talismans with complex requirements. (Link to previous discussion of the last point.)

Some ideas for improving this:

* Have a hotkey that brings up a window displaying all talismans for the current level. This could be a pop-up that pauses the game until dismissed. It should be available both during play and on the preview screen. (ccexplore suggested something along these lines, in the topic linked above.)
* Replace the preview screen's talisman display with "X of Y talismans unlocked" and a reminder of what the talisman-display hotkey is.
* On the postview screen, if multiple talismans exist, replace "You unlocked a talisman!" with "X of Y talismans unlocked!". (Consideration: in this case should X be the number the player has just unlocked with their level completion, or the total number unlocked on the level? I think the latter would be more helpful.)

[Proxima]

As an aside: I know of at least one level that made deliberate use of multiple talismans being concealed, by having a bronze talisman requiring saving X or using at most Y builders, then a silver or gold talisman for saving even more or using even fewer. The intention was that the player would challenge themselves to solve the bronze talisman first, then have a "holy ****!" moment when the game informed them that the more stringent requirement was achievable.

This shouldn't be dismissed, but there are two big problems with leaving things as they are. Firstly, this intended effect falls completely flat when the game doesn't inform the player about the second/third talisman. Secondly, a level may have multiple talismans that are not hard-and-harder versions of the same challenge, but orthogonal (e.g. one for saving X, another for at most Y builders). In the case the player would benefit from learning about the talismans at the same time so they could choose which they prefer to work on first.

[namida]

1. Agreed. The only place this is immediately noticable is the level select menu. Even here, it doesn't particularly draw attention to it (just, it does at least make it visible), and it is very likely that in an extended session, the user is not visiting this menu between every level.

2. This is a relatively minor issue as it can still be found somewhere, but yeah, it would be nicer to make this a bit easier.

3a. What should be done about this? More spacing between the lemming count / save requirement (and if applicable time limit), or do you suggest some other usage?

3b. Yeah, this needs improvements - but the other topic, which is still open, covers that issue.

[ccexplore]

Can someone remind me some details of the current talismans system?  It sounds like you can create as many as you like, and classify each independently as gold/silver/bronze however you want?  Or is it more like a one gold, one silver, one bronze system (probably not, since I'm not getting any sense that there are always 3 talismans)?

Talismans are basically NeoLemmix's version of achievements, and across many different games I've seen all kinds of variations on how achievements are shown or not shown.  I do think the safe default is to be able to just show them all on the outset (ie. user can at any time find out exactly what they are in terms of requirements).  A progressive-unlock system like Proxima mentioned in the aside is interesting and not uncommon amongst other games, but I still feel like it's more common that no achievements are hidden on the outset.  Games using progressive-unlock achievements are also generally very systematic about it--usually each different kind of achievement (eg. "solve X puzzles without requesting hints", "solve a puzzle under N minutes", "find Y of whatever scattered throughout the game", etc.) each has M levels (eg. bronze, silver, gold) of achievements.  Some games also have a few to many completely hidden achievements where the player is never informed they exist nor what the requirements are beforehand, and only find out about one upon achieving it.  I'm not generally a fan of that and so I guess it's good thing that you can't really do that currently in NeoLemmix.

Most games have a relatively easy way to review achievements while in-game (and by that I really mean "in-level" or similar).  Either there is direct access to it (ie. a hotkey and/or some UI element you can always find and click on to show the list), or you go through the main in-game menu to get to it.  Most games also notify the player immediately in-game (typically via notification-style flyouts that are non-modal and disappears on its own after a few seconds) whenever an achievement is achieved, though I think it's fine for NeoLemmix to not be that immediate and just tell the player about it on the postview screen or similar.

[Proxima]

Yeah, you can create as many as you like and classify them independently. The vast majority of levels have no talisman or only one, but I believe the game should continue to allow multiple talismans since there are some cases of levels (existing or planned) that benefit from it, and allowing it does no harm if we can solve the discoverability issue.

Pressing F4 on the main menu will call up a list of all talismans in the current pack, allowing multiple talismans per level to be discovered (whether they are progressive or orthogonal), but most of the time the player won't exit play to check this list during a session.