How to remove background images from level in editor?

[Nepster]

Assume that I want to create a level in the city style or in the honeycomb style. Then upon creating a new level in this style in the editor, there is already a background image preselected. I can change this background image to a different one by the "Select Background" button in the "Level properties" window.
But how can I remove the background image completely so that only the usual black background is displayed?

I know of one very hackish solution: Choose a different primary style that doesn't have any background image and then use the ability to mix styles to add all the terrain pieces and objects in the style I actually want to use. But there must be a better solution...

[IchoTolot]

Simply press "F7" to toggle on/off backgrounds. Or click on "View" in the top menu, there you can find all sorts of operations to turn on/off irritating stuff. I even sometimes turn off objects


Note this works only for background images and not single-colored backgrounds, but I imagine the images are the only real problem here as the single colored ones are mostly only used to help you actually seeing stuff (like L2 shadow).

[Nepster]

Thanks, but this is only a temporary solution: Once I restart the editor and load the level, the background is there again and the same holds when playtesting in the player.
But I want more: I want to delete the background image information from the level file itself, so that noone can ever see a background image on this level regardless of their settings.

[IchoTolot]

A function for the player itself could also help there: A hotkey to toggle on/off background images in game. So the player can have the black bg or the image if he chooses so. Then he has total control.

[Nepster]

This already exists in the player (though only as a option in the menu, not as a hotkey). But there are sometimes reasons not to display the background image in a level, even to users who usually want to have background images, e.g.
- I think the background image is ugly.
- The background image doesn't fit with the theme of my specific level, even if it fits with the overall theme of the style.
- Parts of the background image are particularly misleading in combination with my level. So I expect that players gain more in terms of playability than they lose in terms of nice visuals.
We keep lots of options because level designers should be able to decide how their level should look like, cf. fake, inverted or only-on-terrain objects. So we should as well accept the wish of level designers who think their level should not have a background at all.

[Gronkling]

I change the main tileset to one that doesn't have a background to get around this. However it would be very good to have an option not to use a background as they can be annoying on levels with small details. Also I just like how it looks more.

[Simon]

For simplicity, the author should be able to pick no bg, or one of the bgs of the primary style.

Otherwise, you have a weird either-or rule: If the style has no bg, then you must have no bg; otherwise you must have exactly one bg. This tastes bitter in information theory.

To work around the unnecessary either-or rule, Nepster and Gronkling already choose primary sets P completely different from the set T where their tiles live, only to get the black bg. This introduces bad cultural coupling between P and T. You can't change bgs or bridge colors in P without considering what happens in T.

-- Simon

[mobius]

I may have posted long ago but I'll reiterate my suggestions here:

This is the way it should be done: Having the background as an object like it used to be was actually better.

CONS: -having to manually place the background in every level.

PROS: -you can choose between any number of backgrounds and make your own. Your not locked into using only one that somebody else decided was fit for this tileset (dumb imo).
-you can choose NOT to have a background, something which apparently at least several people want all the time. Even myself who likes the idea of backgrounds, may not want one on every level. Sometimes they looks good; sometimes they don't.
-You can move the background around to exactly where you want it. This could be vitally important and reduce the annoyance of having the background image confuse the player. You are able to place it in the bets spot to look visually best and avoid confusion.

I realize there may be some issues with this: For example I do very much like the format that lets the image automatically get multiplied across the whole screen. Can this be done even when it's used as an object in the editor?

In any case; even if it's not treated as a object like before;
A - you shouldn't be forced to use it
B - you shouldn't be forced to use only 1 background image per style.
Both of these things make no sense imo.

Nepster just informed me that my one point is moot: multiple backgrounds per style is supported. And this system seems okay except that a background shouldn't get selected automatically; for people/cases who don't want one for this particular level.
My point about moving the image around still stands but I could easily live without this.

[IchoTolot]

This is the way it should be done: Having the background as an object like it used to be was actually better.

The old was completly horrible!
For every change you would have to do to the level having already placed the background-object you would have to delete + replace it in case another object in the level is to be changed, or manually disable object rendering which lets the other objects disapear as well. Also the level load time was significantly longer, too.
To have the choice between one of the backgrounds or none is fine, but please keep the new way of doing so as the old way is nothing but trouble and having the ability to choose the starting position of the background isn't worth much to be honest.