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Lemmings Boards => Contests => Topic started by: IchoTolot on February 22, 2018, 03:39:24 PM

Title: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 22, 2018, 03:39:24 PM
All levels (14 NeoLemmix level): https://www.dropbox.com/s/clfisey2k2y3uy8/Contest14_levels.zip?dl=1

- The .lvl levels can be loaded with the last old format Neolemmix Player.

Levels in NXP pack form: https://www.dropbox.com/s/t4sx2l5h3kac1bt/Contest14LevelCollection.nxp?dl=1

- The pack can be loaded with the last old format Neolemmix Player.

Music: https://www.dropbox.com/s/6cdxtzckvepkb23/Contest14_music.zip?dl=1

- The music must be put inside the music folder of the NeoLemmix player. If the folder doesn't exists, create it.

Tilesets (should not be needed if you only use the nxp pack): https://www.dropbox.com/s/njngutk490r56cd/Contest14_tilesets.zip?dl=1

- The tilesets must be put inside the styles folder of the NeoLemmix player. If the folder doesn't exists, create it.

Note: Some of the tilesets from Flopsy in here as I recall were originally not to be released for the old format --- if you want to make your own levels with them rather check out the actively maintained new format version! I just needed to include them here so you actually have the ability to access the single levels in here made with them.

Rule 1 Levels

IchoTolot's "Arctic Oscillation" (V1)
bulletride's "Whiplash" (V4)
Crane's "Cloning Vats" (V7)
Nessy's "Guardians Of The Hero's Shrine" (V7)
Raymanni's "Little house on the hill" (V1)

Rule 2 Levels

IchoTolot's "I Demand a Builder!" (V1)
Colorful Arty's "The Possimpible" (V3)
bulletride's "Medusa" (V2)
Flopsy's "Mystic Cave Lemmings" (V5)
Nessy's "Journey" (V4)
SQron188's "Danger Ahead" (V4)

Rule 3 Levels

Colorful Arty's "Adios amiga!" (V1)
Crane's "Die Doppelganger" (V11)
Flopsy's "This is not A Star Wars rip off" (V3)

You can check the rules details again here: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=3636.0

Playing Phase will be closed on 31th of March!
Updates will close on 28th of March!

Note: This topic is for posting your comments, replays, etc for the levels. If you wish to post an update to your level, or enter a late submission, please do so in the Updates Topic instead.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: SQron188 on February 22, 2018, 06:24:02 PM
Here's one solution to Flopsy's "This is not A Star Wars rip off".
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nepster on February 22, 2018, 07:22:23 PM
Here is a bunch of replays (and backroutes). Please forgive me for not posting detailed comments - I just haven't have time, just as I haven't had time to properly think about the levels where I didn't see an approach after looking at the level for a brief time.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 22, 2018, 07:58:31 PM
Well... damn!  Backrouted to hell!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on February 22, 2018, 10:40:32 PM
Here's my solutions to bulletride's and Crane's rule 1 levels, which are my favourites out of the whole contest batch.

Special shout out to bulletride's level, really enjoyed that one.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 23, 2018, 01:02:12 AM
My solution to Whiplash V2:
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: bulletride on February 23, 2018, 01:27:15 AM
Lots of challenging levels this pack I am impressed! This might take a while :p

Little House on the Hill:
Spoiler
Fantastic level! Had me stumped for a while. :thumbsup: 

Danger Ahead:
Spoiler
Good level but the style/background made it a difficult to see where the terrain was so I played it all in physics only mode.  Wouldn't have noticed that notch the glider turns around on without it.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on February 23, 2018, 01:36:40 AM
Quote from: bulletrideChanged up my rule 1 level a bit to prevent part of Nepster's and Flopsy's solutions on the third entrance.  This should force you to use another destructive skill at least. Also changed one of the vines height a bit so you can bash across. There still should be at least 2 solutions still. Let me know if you think the original version was better though...  I can attempt to ignore my left over skill phobia

(Quoted from the Update topic)

I preferred your version 1 level bulletride, I was happy with the solution I found for your level and it was one of the few levels I managed to solve in this contest which astonished me.
I was stunned to hear this level was back routed.

Your choice at the end of the day though.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 23, 2018, 01:56:07 AM
Some more solutions for everyone ("Guardians Of The Hero's Shrine" (V2), "Little house on the hill" (V1), "Medusa" (V1), "This is not A Star Wars rip off" (V2)):
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on February 23, 2018, 02:23:38 AM
Just a comment to all of the people who are doing videos for the contest levels.

Can you please make sure you upload the replays for my levels in this topic as well, thanks :)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: joshescue18 on February 23, 2018, 03:03:01 AM
Here is a solution of the level "Danger Ahead".
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: joshescue18 on February 23, 2018, 03:09:53 AM
Here is my solution to the level by Raymani.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: bulletride on February 23, 2018, 04:07:14 AM
Crane rule 3 V2 replay attached
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: SQron188 on February 23, 2018, 09:33:52 AM
@bulletride

Spoiler
Excellent work, you got my intended solution!
And I suppose it's how the tileset is and I knew I'd have a use for that crooked-shaped piece. Sorry if it eluded/confused you. :)
And I really enjoy the choice of music for your levels!

@joshescue

Spoiler
Excellent work, too! It's a very slight backroute but I think I can update that accordingly. Thanks for your help!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: joshescue18 on February 23, 2018, 05:19:46 PM
Here are my solutions of your levels.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 23, 2018, 05:28:09 PM
Quote from: joshescue18 on February 23, 2018, 05:19:46 PM
Here are my solutions of your levels.

Ah yes, thank you! :thumbsup:   You really helped me with the testing through your solutions! Could cut 2 skills in the first R1 level and you found a very creative alternative solution in the R2 one.

I even included your R2 solution in my showcase video! :) (currently uploading)

Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 23, 2018, 06:38:19 PM
The videos are up! ;)

Rule 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6XwoBEBY5Q
Rule 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PXc4MB4x7A
Rule 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_M-hKY-cXM0

My own levels if you want to see the intended solution: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYu2awdzE6I

I also attached my replays to this post!

Really high level quality here, great job to the designers! :thumbsup:     Currently I found it overall a bit easier, but maybe this can change if I found a ton of horrible backroutes ;P
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 23, 2018, 07:48:33 PM
Included Crane's new music track in the music zip link + I attached an updated replay to the V3 of the level. :)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 23, 2018, 08:11:23 PM
Bah you - I thought about putting in the shorter time limit on V3, but decided against it because the shape of the terrain would stop your dig/walker trick! Evidently you had other ideas!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 23, 2018, 08:24:39 PM
Quote from: Crane on February 23, 2018, 08:11:23 PM
Bah you - I thought about putting in the shorter time limit on V3, but decided against it because the shape of the terrain would stop your dig/walker trick! Evidently you had other ideas!

Can't match my speed! Resolved! Maybe the dig + fence would also work here. ;P
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 23, 2018, 09:54:37 PM
And with the V5 solving I will take a little break, it's your turn for now! I leave some backroutes to find for the others. 8-)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on February 23, 2018, 09:57:01 PM
Quote from: IchoTolot on February 23, 2018, 06:38:19 PM
Currently I found it overall a bit easier, but maybe this can change if I found a ton of horrible backroutes ;P

My rule 2 level was a back route, Rule 3 was spot on.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on February 24, 2018, 02:00:20 AM
Glad you enjoyed my levels IchoTolot :)

Comments

Guardians Of The Hero's Shrine: Your first solution was a backroute but I love your second solution. I want to try one more time to enforce my solution but if all else fails your solution will be an excellent "alternate" :)

Journey: This is a backroute unfortunately, but an easy fix. Also, good feedback on the pick-up skills. My updated version should fix this and increase the entropy a little bit more.


Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 24, 2018, 11:30:17 AM
Quote from: Nessy on February 24, 2018, 02:00:20 AM
Glad you enjoyed my levels IchoTolot :)

Comments

Guardians Of The Hero's Shrine: Your first solution was a backroute but I love your second solution. I want to try one more time to enforce my solution but if all else fails your solution will be an excellent "alternate" :)

Journey: This is a backroute unfortunately, but an easy fix. Also, good feedback on the pick-up skills. My updated version should fix this and increase the entropy a little bit more.

Just want to say: My "awesome" solution seems to fail now, but the backroute replay is still 100% functional, I did not even change a thing. ;)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 24, 2018, 02:52:38 PM
Here is the whole bunch resolved in it's current form -- note that from Nessy's R1 level the Version 2 level is Undetermined, so that he may exactly exam which of my solutions still work.

And I smell another big backroute again on Arty's R2 level. ;)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on February 24, 2018, 02:57:11 PM
My Rule 2 solution is close enough to intended, you only did it in a more complicated way which is fine
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: joshescue18 on February 24, 2018, 04:14:37 PM
Here are my solutions of levels by Colorful Arty.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Colorful Arty on February 24, 2018, 04:27:15 PM
Icho:
Spoiler
thanks for another backroute; keep them coming! Ironically, you could have been more efficient and saved a destructive skill on that backroute. More one-way arrows seal that one up good though.

joshescue:
Spoiler
Excellent solution to my Rule 3 level! You're the only one who's been able to save an extra Lemming and use both cloners in meaningful ways! Probably better than my solution! :thumbsup:

However, your Rule 2 solution has already been patched out thanks to IchoTolot. I'd give the level another go if I were you, but it's your choice.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 24, 2018, 07:53:12 PM
Resolved Nessy's levels. :)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 25, 2018, 04:03:33 PM
And here are new solutions to Crane's levels.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 25, 2018, 04:50:24 PM
And again Nessy's levels :)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: bulletride on February 25, 2018, 08:46:53 PM
Here are replays for Nessy and Crane rule 1 as well as Artys rule 3.

Question for Artys rule 2...
Spoiler

I have a solution that would work except for the fact that I cannot use 2 skills on the same frame at the start of the level (1 on each lemming).  Was this intended to block a backroute? Just wondering if maybe a difference in Neolemmix player versions is preventing me from beating it or if I simply have the wrong solution lol

Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 25, 2018, 09:11:50 PM
@IchiTolot: Spot on with Rule 1.  Rule 3 is just embarrassing!

@bulletride: Nice find on the backroute.  Just got to check that my fix doesn't open up something else.

Patching time!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 25, 2018, 10:11:15 PM
Resolved Crane's stuff again ;)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 25, 2018, 10:27:00 PM
Damn that Die Doppelgänger dastardly darn double digger deed!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 25, 2018, 11:11:02 PM
And resolved Nessy's R1 again.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Colorful Arty on February 25, 2018, 11:24:31 PM
To answer bulletride's question:
Spoiler

All NeoLemmix player versions prevent you from assigning multiple different skills on the same frame. Me lining everything up just right so you cannot assign those skills at the same time was the ONLY way to enforce the intended solution. I'm sorry for that. :(
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 25, 2018, 11:33:21 PM
In only saw now that Arty uploaded V3 of his level.

So to make it clear again here:

"Make a new post for a new update; do not edit your most recent post. You may, however, post updates to multiple entries (if you have more than one) in the same post."

I didn't saw the new update for a while now.

Also please attach both up-to-date version of your levels to the new post, so that the old can be deleted.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: bulletride on February 25, 2018, 11:45:49 PM
Quote from: Colorful Arty on February 25, 2018, 11:24:31 PM
To answer bulletride's question:
Spoiler

All NeoLemmix player versions prevent you from assigning multiple different skills on the same frame. Me lining everything up just right so you cannot assign those skills at the same time was the ONLY way to enforce the intended solution. I'm sorry for that. :(

I figured as much was just double checking :evil:. back to the drawing board!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 26, 2018, 12:32:43 AM
Well, I'm completely stumped on The Possimpible. Everything I try ends up with a skill short, and any attempts of trying to circumvent the level (on the assumption that Colorful Arty is playing with our psychology) is met with failure.

Spoiler
Even the clue that the spacing at the start is the only way to reinforce the intended solution hasn't yielded me with any workable solutions yet.  That is my biggest clue though... it was the only way to reinforce the intended solution, something that removing a Walker, for example, couldn't fix.

If I had a minor complaint, the use of up arrows seems to violate the spirit of 'no steel' in the rule 2 levels, in my opinion, especially coupled with the lack of Fencers.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Colorful Arty on February 26, 2018, 01:09:56 AM
Fair point Crane about the one-way up arrows. I could probably accomplish the same thing using tons of one-way left, right, and down arrows, but that would be an indistinguishable mess.

Keep trying and don't be afraid to think outside the box or try new things.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 26, 2018, 01:45:42 AM
Managed to solve "Journey" and "Danger Ahead" (R2L5 and R2L6) - I love the atmosphere in the Alien-themed "Danger Ahead", although the background makes it difficult to see exactly where the terrain boundaries are, and I ended up having to play the level with clear physics on.

Also, to whomever made the Alien tileset... it's beautiful, but can the exit have some kind of light on it? If I had to recommend something, it would be some kind of tech exit with a spinning hazard light (those beacons with a rotating reflector inside a coloured perspex dome).
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on February 26, 2018, 01:51:18 AM
Quote from: Crane on February 26, 2018, 01:45:42 AM
Managed to solve "Journey"...

Your solution to "Journey" is intended. Well done :)

May I ask for your quick thoughts on the difficulty of the level? From my perspective I'm afraid it has become a tad easier after the backroute fixes :(
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 26, 2018, 02:00:44 AM
I found it decently challenging actually.  I had to think a bit in regards to how to reduce the number of skills I used in order to merge to the two crowds of Lemmings as well as find a way to get the Basher pick-up without turning the Lemming around...

Spoiler
...and the fact that there are Blockers and you can lose a Lemming disguises the fact that you have to sacrifice one to the Ghostbuster trap so the pathfinder can get through.  Building through a thin wall to provide a platform to land on is quite an advanced trick as well.

It's certainly easier than some of the other levels, but you don't have to make them hard.  They have to be enjoyable, first and foremost, and this one was very enjoyable - well done.  The up arrows look a bit weird, but I gather these are for patching a backroute and hence they can't be left-facing like the rest (or steel, since the rules forbid it).

Any luck on solving my levels? And opinions too.

----

Oh, one extra artistic complaint... the up and down arrows on the Fire tileset really need to scroll in the same direction as the arrowhead, because it's very hard to work out exactly how much terrain is covered by them, even with clear physics enabled.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on February 26, 2018, 02:20:33 AM
Thanks Crane :)

Don't worry my intention is not to make the levels brutally tough; my main concern was just making sure it wasn't as straightforward as I thought it was in my head.

Quote from: Crane on February 26, 2018, 02:00:44 AM
Any luck on solving my levels? And opinions too.

I'm going to start recording myself solving the levels soon. I look forward to playing your levels especially your Rule 3 one as it looks very good and creative :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on February 26, 2018, 05:12:03 PM
I have finally started recording the Rule 1 contest levels (I have also attached my replays below). I solved all of them except "Arctic Oscillation" (and my level, of course ;)). Overall this was a great start to the contest :thumbsup:

Rule 1 Part 1 (IchoTolot and Bulletride's level) (https://youtu.be/pLMUD0iDl0I)
Rule 1 Part 2 (Crane, Raymanni, and more attempts on IchoTolot's level) (https://youtu.be/ld2pFZFOi2U)

Arctic Oscillation

Couldn't solve this one, but I am confident that I am on the right track at least with the right side. Still an excellent level :)

Whiplash

Not sure if my solution is 100% intended, but very nice level! Great work :)

Cloning Vats

I think I might have backrouted this level slightly :-[, but the solution I found was really good. My only comment is that it is not obvious that a lemming will splat when he falls off the ledge on the right into the water because it looks like the terrain he splats on is covered with water. Regardless, it was no big deal to me ;) Great work :)

Little House On The Hill

Very nice level and puzzle! It was very much a think outside the box type as I had to figure out creative ways to use my destructive skills to crave the most efficient path through the house on the hill. Great work :)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: mobius on February 27, 2018, 01:00:21 AM
I solved all the levels.... not really :P

excellent music selections for all of these levels!

I played some of the levels; I was able to solve 2 so far. I'll play the rest and solve more later.

BulletRide:
Spoiler
Whiplash:
this graphic set was new to me; it's very nice, I really like it overall except I just wish it was a tad brighter. It's a bit too dark and hard to see for my taste.
A nice and very tricky small/three lemming level. I feel like I backrouted; after realizing the main problem is turning people around I resorted to an old trick and seemed maybe a tad too easy.

Medusa:
A Very nice complex level, the main puzzle being deciding how to get over each obstacle and where to use what. Getting close but haven't solved it yet.


Nessy:
Spoiler
Guardians of the Hero's Shrine:
Cool layout and another interesting puzzle similar to Whiplash (oh right I guess that's not a surprise; I forgot for a moment that this was a contest with level making stipulations).
Again however I feel like I might have backrouted it; solution felt a little hackish, wasn't too hard. Although there was some interesting interaction; definitely a better solution then my first solution (which only solved on an earlier version)

Journey:
Very complex level at first glance.

Flopsy:
Spoiler
Mystic Cave Lemmings:
cool aesthetics, looks very challenging at first. Looks very difficult to get aroudn the obstacles with so few builders, several possible routes.

Arty:
Spoiler
you start with 9 builders so you basically have unlimited builders.
I didn't play this level because I just danced to the music.
Also a challenge of too few builders. Looks intimidating , but many possible paths to take.

IchoTolot:
Spoiler
I demand a builder!:
Nice simple level that requires no-builder tricks, which I'm notoriously bad at.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Ryemanni on February 27, 2018, 01:05:58 PM
I see there's been a hefty amount of updates. I would appreciate a compiled pack before I start playing these levels. :evil:
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 27, 2018, 01:12:44 PM
Quote from: Raymanni on February 27, 2018, 01:05:58 PM
I see there's been a hefty amount of updates. I would appreciate a compiled pack before I start playing these levels. :evil:

I am constantly recompliling, the first post does not only list the most recent versions, it also tells which versions are currently in the nxp download-link. Both nxp and the first post get updated together. I'm a busy bee ;)

Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Ryemanni on February 27, 2018, 01:51:08 PM
Alright! Time to get playing.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on February 27, 2018, 04:31:53 PM
I have continued onto Rule 2, but only managed to play the first three levels and only solve bulletride's level :P

Rule 2 Part 1 (IchoTolot and Arty's level) (https://youtu.be/DGtprzO4wWw)
Rule 2 Part 2 (bulletride and more attempts on IchoTolot and Arty's level) (https://youtu.be/5QjIwgT8K3I)

I Demand A Builder

All your contest levels so far have me stumped, but I still refuse to demand a builder ;). Overall I think I figured out at least 50% of the solution. Need to stretch my mind a little bit more to figure out the rest of the solution. Great music by the way :D

The Possimpible

This one has me stumped, and I'm not even sure I'm on the right track to be honest. Seems like it is going to be a great "two lemming" puzzle from what I have experienced so far. Great music by the way :D

Medusa

Excellent level! I am confident I solved this one intentionally and it was a great puzzle :)

Flopsy and SQron's levels, you're up next!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 27, 2018, 07:57:32 PM
Ok, for now I will need to slow down because of other stuff, but here's at least Cranes R3 resolved.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on February 27, 2018, 09:03:17 PM
Normally I'd be annoyed that you backrouted it again, but I can't help but be impressed at your knowledge of every trick in the book and your skill at finding every nook and cranny in the terrain!  Version 9 incoming!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: bulletride on February 27, 2018, 10:51:30 PM
replays for Nessy and Flopsy.

Nessy
Spoiler

Rule 2: Great level! I love how there are tons of almost possible solutions but you always end up one skill short. The solution is great as it seems so simple when you find yet still took me ages to figure it out ;P

Rule 1: This one is a great level as well, same thing with your other level lots of possibilities for solutions. I am not sure if its a back route still though as it seems pretty similar to my old solution.


Flopsy
Spoiler
Rule 3:Bombing positioning can be a little annoying (assuming this is intended) but besides that a good level. I would personally make the level a little bit wider so you can add little bit of space on the right side of the level (even if its just like fire there) as it feels a little cramped working on the right side. Not really a big deal though :P

Your rule 2 level is really tough :XD: what I wouldnt do for an extra walker lol.

Medusa solutions:
Spoiler
Icho: your solution wasnt intended but it was similar to something I was fooling around with while making the level. It is technically challenging so I will leave it as a solution :thumbsup:.

Nessy: Your solution is a little bit different than mine but not by much. Definitely an acceptable solution though nice job :thumbsup:

Mobius: Thanks for the feedback on the styleset. It is my first one so before I officially release it I may make it a tad lighter... at least the entrances (I suck at making color pallets lol).
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 27, 2018, 10:57:58 PM
Quote from: bulletride on February 27, 2018, 10:51:30 PM
Mobius: Thanks for the feedback on the styleset. It is my first one so before I officially release it I may make it a tad lighter... at least the entrances (I suck at making color pallets lol).

Don't forget about adding a color for the minimap display ;)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on February 27, 2018, 11:06:21 PM
bulletride

Spoiler
the 2 bombers at the start is not intended but the solution as a whole is intended. You managed to effectively swap a bomber with a digger

I'm surprised to hear my Rule 2 level is super hard, keep at it, you might be overcomplicating it.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on February 28, 2018, 05:46:55 PM
Finished Rule 2, but only solved 1/2 levels :P I also solved "I Demand A Builder". Yay for me! :thumbsup:

I have attached all replays below.

Rule 2 Part 3 (IchoTolot's level solved and Flopsy's level) (https://youtu.be/tXNKUCYAN74)
Rule 2 Part 4 (SQron's level and more attempts on Flopsy's level) (https://youtu.be/bnVuvg9ul-s)

I Demand A Builder

A very interesting and great puzzle! Was fun to solve. Great work :)

Mystic Cave Lemmings

A great level, but I could't solve this one :'(. I am most likely overcomplicating the solution.

Danger Ahead

Great level, and also great to see your Alien tileset in action!

@bulletride

Spoiler

Your solution to my Rule 2 level is intended. Well done! :D Your solution to my Rule 1 level is still unintended, but a very cool solution nevertheless :)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on February 28, 2018, 06:05:37 PM
@ Nessy: Your solution to my R1 level is close to my own solution, great job. It has some smaller differences though, which is great :thumbsup:   There are currently 3 known viable solutions now to it! Although josh's one is way more different. ;P
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: mobius on March 01, 2018, 12:06:05 AM
I Have a lose 3 solution to I Demand a Builder. So I'm getting closer....?
I haven't looked at the updates yet.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 01, 2018, 12:55:05 AM
I'm kind of surprised that "Die Doppelgänger" is proving to be so difficult, or at least not backrouted to oblivion by IchiTolot!  Either that or because it's a Rule 3 level, people are leaving it until last. Granted, as a designer, one may think their level is easy when it's really not and vice versa.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: bulletride on March 01, 2018, 07:08:32 AM
Quote from: Crane on March 01, 2018, 12:55:05 AM
I'm kind of surprised that "Die Doppelgänger" is proving to be so difficult, or at least not backrouted to oblivion by IchiTolot!  Either that or because it's a Rule 3 level, people are leaving it until last. Granted, as a designer, one may think their level is easy when it's really not and vice versa.

Here you go! I was trying to solve some of the levels I hadn't completed yet first. Looks like some more back routes :P.

Edit: Solved Mystic Mines finally! woot! I was pretty close I just needed to make a small adjustment :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on March 01, 2018, 08:41:15 AM
I tried Cranes level again and found another solution.



Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on March 01, 2018, 08:42:44 AM
Quote from: bulletrideEdit: Solved Mystic Mines finally! woot! I was pretty close I just needed to make a small adjustment

Too bad it was a backroute. V3 incoming :)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: bulletride on March 01, 2018, 10:04:20 AM
I Demand A Builder done! I procrastinated this one a bunch because I figured it was going to be a tedious solution, but it ended up being a great level. Nice job :thumbsup:!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on March 01, 2018, 04:54:37 PM
Finished all my recordings of my initial blind playthrough of all levels :thumbsup:

Overall I solved 8/12 levels (12 because I'n not counting my own levels), which isn't too bad for a first-time blind playthough.

Life is going to get a bit busy soon, so I'm going to take a small break before moving on to the bonus content. I will also be solving the contest levels I couldn't solve or levels that got updated off-screen from now on until I finally get the intended solutions, and then I'll show them on-screen for all viewers all at once :)

Rule 3 Part 1 (Arty's level and attempts on Crane's level) (https://youtu.be/350R46cIYYg)
Rule 3 Part 2 (Flopsy's level) (https://youtu.be/_Iuf9Jx2Vt0)

Adios Amiga!

Was a fun level to solve and the visuals were also very nice. Amazing job! :)

Die Doppelgaenger

Unfortunately I couldn't solve this one :XD:, but I really like the level's concept and it's very unique :)

This Is Not A Star Wars Rip-off

Very nice level :) It took me a while to find the unintended solution bulletride found with the two bombers at the beginning, but then I quickly found what I think is the true intended solution :) Also glad I was able to play a level with your new Death Egg tileset. It's very nice from what I have seen on this level!

Once again, thanks to all designers that participated and made this another enjoyable experience :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 01, 2018, 10:12:00 PM
I should be more careful about what I wish for... despite my best attempts, Die Doppelgänger keeps getting broken.  As for bulletride's solution of Cloning Vats... I think for the first time ever in history, I'm going to have to lock the release rate! (found a cleaner patch!)

If there's any clue for the intended solution... more of the upper part of the level is meant to be used!
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on March 02, 2018, 09:07:30 AM
Maybe this is finally intended for Crane's R3 ???
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 02, 2018, 07:14:36 PM
YAY! Finally! That is the intended solution, IchoTolot!  I hope I can consider this level patched now - sorry to put you through so much testing!  I just hope the solution isn't blatantly obvious or the level messy though.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: bulletride on March 04, 2018, 11:00:09 PM
Crane's levels and Flopsy rule 2 resolved.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on March 04, 2018, 11:05:29 PM
And Rule 2 is a back route yet again!

V4 incoming :)
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 05, 2018, 02:26:41 AM
Not all backroutes are yet ironed out, it seems! V11 is now up.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 06, 2018, 08:59:37 AM
I haven't been able to solve IchoTolot's rule 1 level. I kind of know what to do, but can't seem to efficiently get the Floater up to where the Climber starts. I wonder if I'm missing something obvious.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 09, 2018, 02:42:32 AM
I've got a solution for Whiplash (R1L2).  Haven't had much luck with the others yet.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on March 10, 2018, 04:45:56 PM
Here is a solution to the latest version of "Mystic Cave Lemmings".

Feels intended but you never know :8():

I also have another solution to the latest version of "Whiplash".
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on March 19, 2018, 08:49:58 PM
Here is an attempt replay for IchoTolot's Rule 1 level. Hopefully I'm on the right track... or maybe I'm still far, far away?? :P
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on March 20, 2018, 03:38:45 PM
I've made a video about the updated levels and my current attempt to Arty's R2 level which hopefully will give you all a second wind of new ideas for this. ;)

Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkS9opY48Ls&feature=youtu.be
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Colorful Arty on March 20, 2018, 06:25:21 PM
At this point, as much as I would love to see how long it takes people to solve my level without help, I think most people have given up on solving it. So, I have decided to post a few hints to get people thinking in the right direction. None of these hints spoil the solution, but are merely there to help guide your thought process a bit to help you find the solution on your own.

Hint 1:
Spoiler
The level is not a fiddle-fest. There are one or two precise assignments, but the rest is not very precise.

Hint 2:
Spoiler
The hint is in the title. Find the meaning of the title, and that is the first step in the right direction.

Hint 3:
Spoiler
A good strategy for finding the solution is to try to backroute the level. If you see even the potential for a backroute, do whatever you can to make it work. Best case, you find the intended solution, and worse case, I patch it out, making the intended way a bit more clear in the update.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: joshescue18 on March 22, 2018, 01:39:30 AM
I solved Nessy's levels.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Nessy on March 22, 2018, 01:50:57 AM
Thanks joshescue18 for the replays!

Spoiler

Your solution to my Rule 1 level is perfectly acceptable. Nice work :)

Your solution to my Rule 2 level is 100% intended. Well done :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: joshescue18 on March 22, 2018, 02:03:13 AM
I solved Crane's levels.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 24, 2018, 12:26:14 AM
Good job. Your rule 1 solution used a slightly unexpected variation with one of the Cloners, but it's perfectly acceptable, and you still use all of the tools.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 26, 2018, 02:13:58 AM
Backroute for "Guardians of the Hero's Shrine" - I didn't use the Blocker:
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: joshescue18 on March 26, 2018, 10:48:36 PM
I solved both Flopsy's levels.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 27, 2018, 12:35:47 AM
So I'm still trying to solve The Possimpible - I'm trying to work out the meaning of the title other than swapping the first and second syllables of the word "impossible" (but not an actual anagram due to an extra P).  So far I've worked out the following:

Spoiler

If you let the right lemming initially turn instead of bash, you can build under the small circular recess and provide a platform for the lemming on the left if they mine through the pillar (after walking up into the small nook).  This might also be the clue behind the way the level is structured, forcing the basher to leave a lip of terrain, but it being impossible to do if you want the left lemming to build.  Delaying the basher this way lets the rightmost lemming build.  I'm not certain of the benefit yet though.

Spoiler

It is theoretically possible to get the non-climber up the right side of the level with just 4 builders, a basher, a miner and either a walker or another builder, but this doesn't include the tools used to get to the climber's platform on the bottom right or to the left-facing one-way wall in such a way that the non-climber can get there, or extra builders or walkers to ensure a lemming doesn't walk the wrong way.  If you bash into this wall at the right point, and use the walker to stop them, they leave a nook in which they can build partly into the vertical bars to the right of this wall. If you can get the climber to be on the platform beneath the exit facing left, they can mine from above, and then the gap bridged with another builder. The remaining 2 builders are then used to cross the vertical bars and then the final small gap where the climber would normally emerge.

I have yet to find a configuration to make this work without running out of builders first.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: joshescue18 on March 27, 2018, 02:10:31 AM
I have completed bulletride's levels.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Crane on March 27, 2018, 10:52:17 PM
My solution to "Mystic Cave Lemmings" - it kind of got more obvious after you patched Colorful Arty's solution.  I would ponder about opening up that alternative solution since it itself is somewhat hard to find (I nearly got it on the version that Colorful Arty played, but couldn't quite get the precision with the Platformer and Basher).  Also the final Basher/Walker combo is extremely precise to the point of being a little unfair.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: Flopsy on March 27, 2018, 11:05:52 PM
Arty was complaining about how precise his alternate solution had to be so I decided to make it more obvious that you shouldn't be doing it that way. I would have used Steel instead of One Way Arrows to achieve this but it's not allowed, I can use steel after the contest though.
Title: Re: Lemmings Forums Level Contest #14 - Playing Phase (Discussion Topic)
Post by: IchoTolot on March 28, 2018, 07:44:36 PM
Just a quick reminder that the update phase has closed!

After the playing phase ends there will be a small gap between it and the update phase due to a little easter break, but soon after the voting phase will continue as planned.  :)