BitBucket: https://bitbucket.org/namida42/neolemmixplayer/issues/10/simplify-object-options-in-the-editor
As namida is thinking about culling
Only on Terrain and other options (http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2585), this is perhaps a good time to think about merging the options Flip and Face Left.
Here is a list of all(?) object types and what Flip and Face Left do (or don't do):
- Hatch: Face Left changes the direction of spawning lemmings, while Flip just flips the image, which often looks ugly and may confuse players when not used together with Face Left.
- Exit: Face Left has no effect and Flip usually makes the exit ugly.
- No Effect Decoration: Face Left does nothing and Flip may be useful for some pieces.
- Water: Face left has no effect and water is usually almost symmetric, so Flip is mostly useless.
- Right/Left OWW and One-way fields: Face Left does nothing and Flip flips only the image, not the effect. So one can only bash and mine in the wrong direction :devil::devil::devil:.
- Down OWW: Both Face Left and Flips do nothing.
- Traps, Radiation and Slowfreeze: Face Left does nothing, and Flip is very useful for non-symmetric traps.
- Preplaced lemmings and Zombies: Face Left changes the direction in the player, but not the image in the editor. Flip changes only the picture in the editor, but does nothing when actually playing the level. So Flip is confusing and Face Left should as weill mirror the editor picture.
- Pick-up Skills: Face Left does nothing and Flip changes the image. However the mirrored image is much harder to recognize.
- Updrafts and (Anti-)Splat Pad: Neither Face Left nor Flip does anything
- Splitters: Face Left has the correct effect by mirroring both the image and the effect. However Flip only changes the picture, but not the effect on lemmings :devil::devil::devil:.
- Teleporter: Flip just mirrors the image, which depending on the style does either nothing or looks ugly. Face Left however does not change the image, but turns all lemmings around.
- Receiver: Flip does the same as for teleporters. However Face Left has absolutely no effect for receivers.
- Locked Exits and buttons: Flip is the same as for exits and Face Left does nothing.
So there is no object where Flip and Face Left do two different useful things. Therefore I suggest merging them into one option.
The best behavior I could come up with is:
- Hatch, Teleporter: It is impossible to flip the image, it just changes the direction of the lemmings.
- Preplaced lemmings, Zombies, Splitter: Changes starting direction and the image in player and editor.
- Any OWW and One-way field: This cannot be given the flipping/face left option at all. Alternatively it may change both the image and the effect on lemmings.
- Traps and other objects with trigger area: Flips the image and moves the trigger area to the correct position.
- Decoration: Flips only the image and does nothing else.
In all cases, Flip flips the image (and correspondingly moves the trigger area, if applicable) but has no other effect. In the case of objects that don't get displayed in game (eg. preplaced lemmings) this will of course have no effect outside the editor. But it is incorrect to ever say that it does nothing, except on an invisible no-effect object, or a perfectly symmetrical (including trigger area) one.
Now on the other hand - the suggestion to tie Flip and Face Left together on some object types does indeed make a lot of sense. However, in cases where they do indeed have two different effects that cannot be considered "bad design" (which is itself something that I don't see as inherently being grounds to automatically justify removal / change of something; but it can be a contributory factor), it should remain possible to set both. Teleporters are an example of such - just because no current teleporter benefits from being flipped does not mean that no graphic set will ever have one that does. Except in cases where the object's design is generally very specific (such as pickup skills), we should not decide on supported features based on assumptions of what pieces of that type will look like.
Merging these options where it makes sense can be a good thing.
You don't need both for decorative objects for example, but you have written the full list here :)
Quote from: namida on March 14, 2016, 02:32:04 PM
In all cases, Flip flips the image (and correspondingly moves the trigger area, if applicable) but has no other effect.
Thanks for correcting me. Then the behavior is at least consistent, even though I failed to notice this.
Quote from: namida on March 14, 2016, 02:32:04 PM
...considered "bad design" (which is itself something that I don't see as inherently being grounds to automatically justify removal / change of something; but it can be a contributory factor)...
But if the use
always leads to dishonest design, like flipping the images of OWWs or Splitters, it
does automatically justify removal in my opinion.
Quote from: namida on March 14, 2016, 02:32:04 PM
However, in cases where they do indeed have two different effects [...] it should remain possible to set both. Teleporters are an example of such - just because no current teleporter benefits from being flipped does not mean that no graphic set will ever have one that does. Except in cases where the object's design is generally very specific (such as pickup skills), we should not decide on supported features based on assumptions of what pieces of that type will look like.
If you really think flipping teleporters or hatches will become useful, then two options may be kept. I am mostly concerned with two issues:
- Options like Face Left on decoration object, receivers, ... that change nothing at all.
- Options that result in misleading objects, like Flip for OWW.
I still think that providing only one option is the easiest and cleanest solution, but as long as these two issues are taken care of, I will be happy :).
One more thing: The option Invert can be applied to downwards arrows, turning them into upwards arrows while not changing the physics at all. This option should be removed as well.
QuotePreplaced lemmings and Zombies: Face Left changes the direction in the player, but not the image in the editor.
Preplaced lemmings should indeed face left in the editor when the setting is set. Can I ask which graphic set you're having issues with that in?
Quote from: namida on March 18, 2016, 01:44:38 PM
QuotePreplaced lemmings and Zombies: Face Left changes the direction in the player, but not the image in the editor.
Preplaced lemmings should indeed face left in the editor when the setting is set. Can I ask which graphic set you're having issues with that in?
I tried to reproduce this right now, but failed. I have no idea, which style I chose when testing this in the first place. So best ignore my claim for now.
I think more discussion, and proper implementation on both sides rather than just the editor, is needed before anything can fully go ahead in regards to this.
However, I have changed the label from "Flip" to "Flip graphic" to emphasize it doesn't change eg. which direction lemmings come out of a window.